Modified XJ Cherokee Tech XJ (84-01)
All modified tech questions. If it modifies your XJ beyond stock parts ask it here.
Sponsored by:
Sponsored by:

Death wobble issue

Old May 16, 2022 | 07:52 AM
  #1  
zacmac1003's Avatar
Thread Starter
Junior Member
 
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 34
Likes: 0
From: Southmont, NC
Year: 95
Model: Cherokee
Engine: 4.0 HO
Default Death wobble issue

I really hoped I didn't have to make this post but I'm running out of ideas. A few weeks ago I developed death wobble and as of this post I still haven't been able to get rid of it. My Jeep is sitting at 4.5 inches of lift using springs and blocks, cavfab adjustable control arms set to the proper length for my lift, JCR off road one ton under the knuckle steering upgrade, a drop track bar, and 16 inch wheels with 31 inch tires. So far I have replaced all 4 ball joints, a tie rod end, a wheel bearing (the other is fine), and installed a larger bolt in the axle side of the track bar because the other bolt was too small and the holes were a little oblong. If anything my death wobble has gotten worse since replacing these parts. My control arm bushings should not be bad as they are only a year old but I plan and removing the arms and inspecting them anyway. I am currently waiting on a bracket to arrive so I can install a steering damper even though it hasn't been needed since installing the steering and steering dampers supposedly don't cure or cause death wobble. I am also going to take my drag link off to inspect the ends of it. Beyond the things listed here I am at a loss as to why I keep having this issue, the tires are balanced I check them myself on a regular basis (I work in a dealer so it's easy for me to do this stuff when I want). I am open to any and all insights that may go beyond the norm when dealing with death wobble.
Reply
Old May 16, 2022 | 12:57 PM
  #2  
XJChang's Avatar
Member
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
 
Joined: Nov 2021
Posts: 223
Likes: 39
From: Central CA
Year: 2000
Model: Cherokee (XJ)
Engine: 4.0
Default

Do you have an adjustable track bar? Or just a drop bracket. You want the track bar and the steering drag link to be the same angle, parallel to each other. Track bar bushes could be worn out. Control arm bushings?

I get DW on bumpy parts of the freeway, it’s scary and sucks. I need an adjustable track bar because I can physically see the drag link is not at as steep an angle has the track bar.
Reply
Old May 17, 2022 | 12:51 AM
  #3  
EvanM's Avatar
CF Veteran
5 Year Member
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
 
Joined: Aug 2018
Posts: 1,899
Likes: 345
From: Idaho
Year: 89
Model: Cherokee (XJ)
Engine: Peddles
Default

I think under the knuckle steering with dropped track bar could be your cause.
Put track bar back to stock location and see what happens
Reply
Old May 17, 2022 | 07:10 AM
  #4  
zacmac1003's Avatar
Thread Starter
Junior Member
 
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 34
Likes: 0
From: Southmont, NC
Year: 95
Model: Cherokee
Engine: 4.0 HO
Default

It's adjustable track bar and a drop bracket. Just checked the track bar bushing and it's ok. I'll take a look at the angles and see how they look.
Reply
Old May 17, 2022 | 07:14 AM
  #5  
zacmac1003's Avatar
Thread Starter
Junior Member
 
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 34
Likes: 0
From: Southmont, NC
Year: 95
Model: Cherokee
Engine: 4.0 HO
Default

Here is how it looks at the moment.


Here
Reply
Old May 17, 2022 | 07:29 PM
  #6  
EvanM's Avatar
CF Veteran
5 Year Member
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
 
Joined: Aug 2018
Posts: 1,899
Likes: 345
From: Idaho
Year: 89
Model: Cherokee (XJ)
Engine: Peddles
Default

Under the knuckle puts the drag link nearly the same as stock, lowering in the drag link makes it have less angle then the drag link will cause bump steer even with tight new parts.

You neef to measure the angle from end to end of the track bar and compare to the drag link angle youl need to use a straight edge of some Kind. The bend in the track bar doesnt matter. Its from point to point the bends dont affect the working angle.

To me it looks way off but bent bars are hard to see if theyre running parallel to eachother
Reply
Old May 18, 2022 | 05:07 AM
  #7  
Dave51's Avatar
CF Veteran
5 Year Member
Liked
 
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 3,413
Likes: 399
From: Connecticut
Year: 2000
Model: Cherokee (XJ)
Engine: 4.0
Default

Is that an RC track bar extender? 1/4" steel? Bolted tight or welded?


Reply
Old May 19, 2022 | 07:33 AM
  #8  
zacmac1003's Avatar
Thread Starter
Junior Member
 
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 34
Likes: 0
From: Southmont, NC
Year: 95
Model: Cherokee
Engine: 4.0 HO
Default

Originally Posted by Dave51
Is that an RC track bar extender? 1/4" steel? Bolted tight or welded?

​​​​​​​It's a Ebay kit, bolted on, looks pretty thick I'd have to measure it to say for sure the thickness.

Last edited by zacmac1003; May 19, 2022 at 07:35 AM.
Reply
Old May 19, 2022 | 07:35 AM
  #9  
zacmac1003's Avatar
Thread Starter
Junior Member
 
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 34
Likes: 0
From: Southmont, NC
Year: 95
Model: Cherokee
Engine: 4.0 HO
Default

Originally Posted by EvanM
Under the knuckle puts the drag link nearly the same as stock, lowering in the drag link makes it have less angle then the drag link will cause bump steer even with tight new parts.

You neef to measure the angle from end to end of the track bar and compare to the drag link angle youl need to use a straight edge of some Kind. The bend in the track bar doesnt matter. Its from point to point the bends dont affect the working angle.

To me it looks way off but bent bars are hard to see if theyre running parallel to eachother
I'll have to check that, I think I get what you're saying.
Reply
Old Feb 12, 2023 | 11:59 PM
  #10  
conairborne's Avatar
Newbie
 
Joined: Jan 2023
Posts: 10
Likes: 3
From: Hawaii
Year: 1997
Model: Cherokee (XJ)
Engine: 4.0
Default

Did you determine the issue and rid your rig of the DW?
Reply
Old Feb 13, 2023 | 11:00 AM
  #11  
4.3L XJ's Avatar
CF Veteran
 
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 6,588
Likes: 495
From: Chico, CA
Year: 1986
Model: Cherokee
Engine: 4.3L with headers and full 3" exhaust system
Default

Originally Posted by zacmac1003
I really hoped I didn't have to make this post but I'm running out of ideas. A few weeks ago I developed death wobble and as of this post I still haven't been able to get rid of it. My Jeep is sitting at 4.5 inches of lift using springs and blocks, cavfab adjustable control arms set to the proper length for my lift, JCR off road one ton under the knuckle steering upgrade, a drop track bar, and 16 inch wheels with 31 inch tires..
Sounds like your track bar is not parallel with your drag link. Can you post some pics of the front so I can see your steering geometry?
Reply
Old Feb 13, 2023 | 02:00 PM
  #12  
That Jeep Guy XJMJ's Avatar
CF Veteran
15 Year Member
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
 
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 2,609
Likes: 446
From: Michigan
Year: 1987 MJ, 1973 J2000, 1986 XJ, 08 JK
Model: Comanche (MJ)
Engine: 4.0L H.O
Default

Keep in mind the post dates on these comments.. last comment from this originally was May of last year - so this is digging an old thread back up but i feel i can shed some visual clarity to understanding the relationship between the track bar and steering linkage.

Soo for clarity - this is directly a relation of angle between the flex joint (all be it a tie-rod style joint of heim joint) mounting points for both the track bar and link between pitman arm and link between the knuckles. I have seen this link between the knuckles referenced as all kinds of things from drag-link, steer-link, the tie-rod, cross-link etc etc. For my purpose of explaining this im referring to it as the link from pitman arm to link between knuckles. SO as mentioned above - a bend in the/any bar doesn't change the aligning angle of its operation; that is done for functional use of the joint. The bend will typically orient the flex joint for a near middle of travel around ride height. This will maximize its functional travel and lifespan.

If you were to take a roll of 1" wide masking tape and run a length of that across the bolt heads for your track bar joints, Then also run a length of tape from flex joint body (being tie-rod or heim joint) on your pitman arm to link between knuckles you will have a reference of operating angle of each. These now 2 seperate tape lines is what is important that stay parallel to each other. The tape stands out as a solid visual reference against everything going on in your front end.

Another thing to consider is typically you shouldn't drop your track bar mounting point unless you also drop your pitman arm length as well. In stock setup they are aligned to work properly and when you change one and not the other, it changes the operating angle of the link, then you welcome in bump-steer and also the potential to instigate death wobble.

Another point to be made that is often overlooked is the length of both your track bar and link between pitman arm and link between knuckles. These 2 links should be as close to the same length as you can keep them. When you have differing lengths in these 2 links you have 2 different arcs or radius that your suspension is trying to operate within. This puts more stress and induces more premature wear into your joints.

Below i have included a photo from the front end of my J2000 build. You will notice the tape line representing my track bar is spot on parallel to the link from pitman arm to knuckle (different than your steering setup but the principle still applies.)
Also to note both the track bar and link between pitman arm and knuckle are the same length as well.


Reply
Old Feb 25, 2023 | 12:15 PM
  #13  
U21's Avatar
U21
Newbie
Liked
 
Joined: Feb 2023
Posts: 27
Likes: 2
From: Riverview , Fl
Year: 1995
Model: Cherokee (XJ)
Engine: L6 4.0 L
Default

Don't know if this is related but my Jeep rocks side to side, do I have weak springs and how could I stiffen the suspension? I don't think this is normal! It really rocks side to side on road bumps and uneven surfaces as I go through them!


Last edited by U21; Feb 25, 2023 at 12:18 PM. Reason: Tried to upload a clip
Reply
Old Feb 25, 2023 | 01:18 PM
  #14  
Dave51's Avatar
CF Veteran
5 Year Member
Liked
 
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 3,413
Likes: 399
From: Connecticut
Year: 2000
Model: Cherokee (XJ)
Engine: 4.0
Default

You might want to start your thread, lot of folks don't read zombie threads.

That said, replace them. No other option. R&R everything, and I mean everything.
Reply
Related Topics
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
Chick-N-Picker
Stock XJ Cherokee Tech. All XJ Non-modified/stock questions go here
16
Aug 29, 2021 08:21 AM
denson194
Modified XJ Cherokee Tech
15
Jan 17, 2021 06:24 AM
gootz4u
Stock XJ Cherokee Tech. All XJ Non-modified/stock questions go here
13
Aug 6, 2017 09:12 PM
90cherokeeguy
Modified XJ Cherokee Tech
1
Mar 30, 2011 05:47 PM
Justin93
Stock Grand Cherokee Tech. All ZJ/WJ/WK Non-modified/stock questions go here!
9
Nov 21, 2010 10:58 AM

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:44 AM.