jessenator

Cool. Thanks for posting that elsewhere to get more info!

I don't understand the discrepancy in placement of the pre-97. Are those placement diagrams incorrect? I mean, it is the internet, and who knows wtf people cite sources from or gather things. They look old and period correct, and super isometric-like. I wonder if there's some official, factory/dealer catalog floating around.

But if they're truly static cling and not permanent adhesive, they could get moved at will. Heck, I wonder if major dealers took liberties and just put them where they thought they'd look good.

Ralph77

That exact thought occurred to me about them being able to be moved around and slapped wherever. Was hoping for more info, hence the post on another forum, but minimal at best. I am a member of 2 other forums so I will pose the question on them also. Plus I am in tight with my guy at the Jeep Dealership. Thinking he might not know for sure but has been there long enough to have dealt with some '96 down ones. Pose the question to him and see what he says.

jessenator

Rock on.

Another thing that's got me on edge:
I did some searching and repro decal sales are potentially infringing. The examples I came across were not really in the same league as what I'm doing: using actual trademarks in original overall designs or historical designs with current trademarks in them. I made it plain I can't do mass quantities for profit of any registered trademark, which I'm not.

I searched the national registry of trademarks and didn't find the "up county suspension group" lockup anywhere under multiple searches. Did find many humorous uses of the word "Jeep" though. Apparently, "BarbieJeepGirl" is a registered trademark!

I read examples of folks getting served not only with cease-and-desists, but concordant fines incredibly disproportionate to whatever they made from selling.

Again, since this particular idea has no jeep, Chrysler, mopar, AMC branding in it, don't know if FCA would take much notice or care. Wish I could talk to an IP law specialist though...

Ralph77

The slightest hesitation on your part to not do this is understandable. You don't need the headaches. I would not even know where to try to find out if this would be an issue. You seem to have a couple ideas. There is no R with a circle around it or the letters TM. Plus I came across this but be damned if I understand what I am reading:

https://www.l4sb.com/blog/tm-means-trademark-of-logo/

Thinking if there is even the slightest chance you could get jammed up then no.

Was thinking about what CJ7-Tim said. Not on his '00. But started to wonder if he bought this new and if so maybe the dealership just did not put it on?

When it comes to all things Jeep though he knows his !@#$. So I see no reason to doubt him. Static Cling and all. LOL

jessenator

Yeah, it's amazing how many clients I've worked with who have declined to go through the trademark registration process. Most don't even slap "TM" on it to dissuade potential copycats.

Putting it up on eBay would probably draw a lot more attention, and potentially negative attention, than if I did it by word of mouth, but my ROI wouldn't recoup as fast.

One other random thought just popped into my head:

What if the reason we don't see too many of these decals on the wild is because they've all jostled loose because they were only static cling?



Edit: I just now realized, that image he linked from AllPar is of a '97+ XJ. So perhaps the pre-'97 placement is correct?

jessenator

If these catalogs I've found can be taken as genuine, some interesting facts:

From '91-'93, it seems only the ZJ had the "up country suspension" [no "group" named on the p/n, but it matches] decal.
link to the 91-31 parts catalog: it doesn't overtly specify a placement position.

For the XJ and the MJ, only the "off road vehicle package" decal (p/n 5501 6564) is specified, and on the liftgate glass, lower driver's side. I can't find a scrap of that design anywhere on the out-facing internet.


From '94-'96,the diagram herein matches the one from MoparPartsGiant, with it on the rear liftgate glass, lower driver's side.
See the catalog here. Interesting.


Sadly, I can't find a complete 97-99 parts catalog, except for a clickbaity/paywall site that houses a number of other PDFs of dubious content. I say "97-99" because that's what said site called it. It matched the naming format of the previous two catalogs at any rate, but only for the XJ. Seems like they split the models into separate catalogs at this point. Thanks, Daimler -heads. Found a print version of the 97-99 XJ catalog, but my curiosity isn't worth $65+$8... seriously, why do people still separate shipping costs on ebay? They'll get more hits if it's just combined and marked as "free shipping."


I did find PDFs of each, 97, 98, 99 on jeepdex.com and they share the same diagram as the ones previously found in this thread. Tellingly, the 2000 parts catalog omits both P/Ns for the "Up country" decal. 99 must indeed have been the last year, as you pointed out, Ralph. Stupidly, those PDFs on jeepdex aren't easily searchable, even though they're full, live text and not purely scans.

The nice thing about those pre-97 catalogs is that they also detail all suspension parts included on the respective packages for MJ, XJ, ZJ, and YJ. Pretty nifty!

jessenator

It's not 100%, but I think it's 95% there...




What I need is some accurate measurements of each door panel (84-96) right on that ridge on the door. My 96's front and rear panels are warped from the crash. Also, the outline source I used is probably not an engineering drawing, just a mockup to show approach angles...


These numbers, except the rear door, aren't definite. Please, PLEASE correct me and I'll get a more accurate depiction-- of course, the panels aren't flat, they're contoured, so that will affect it all as well.

I'll be making a 97+ mockup preview after this one is done.

edit: 97–01 panel widths

jessenator

...no rest for the wicked

jessenator

Got the physical proof today!



I'm going to try to get another one, rasterize it myself and see if that cleans up the pattern.

Might clean up the tree branch shape a bit as well.

Tbone289

That turned out great!

Ralph77

Great is not the word for it.

jessenator

Lol. Well, in fairness to them, they did cut it after the fact— i.e. they didn't align the cutter with the print registration, so that's why it's way wonky.

I'm talking with them, too, about the halftone. It looks identical to the file I printed straight out of Adobe Illustrator to an office printer— now this may not seem like a big deal, but unless the vector files go through a RIP (raster image processor) the method of taking the vector art and converting it to points for a printer is …not as crisp.

A poor man's rip is to take the file, open it in Photoshop, make pixels out of it there, and print from THAT file. I know it sounds like an extra step, but I printed the same artwork from a file rasterized in Photoshop and it looks near-as-makes-no-difference to the scan of the original, printed at 1:1:



I'm going to ask/pay for another proof and see how that looks. Definitely going to find out what it's going to take for the cut to be consistent and correct.

Tbone289

Hell, it looks good to me. I get it though--I'm paid to be picky in my area of expertise as well. LOL

JandDGreens

Obviously my decals show a little worse for the ware but I think the fact that everything is original I might be of some help in getting the measurements for the 2-dr version of what you are trying to achieve. Anyways I sent you a P.M. and Ralph had alerted me through a P.M. of what you want to make available (Sell?) I can get better photos when the sun is not where it is currently.

jessenator

Got to working on Black Bertram's design now I've got a more accurate canvas to work on. I think it's coming along nice. Not quite done, but I'll see how this feels after a couple days: