TwoXJS

Hey, guys. Recent trip to the JY scored me a good pitman arm off a V8 ZJ, even though it wasn't on my list of things to get. Just happened to think about when I found said vehicle....Anyway, I know it's supposedly an upgrade, and I can kinda see how since the ZJ one has about a extra inch of drop compared to the OEM one.

Just wanted a little info on HOW it's supposed to upgrade, along with what the best way to pull the old one without damaging the steering box. I don't see it being easy....at all.

SteveMongr

It will likely induce bumpsteer, unless you already heave bumpsteer. I tried one.
The only way to get it off is with a pimtan arm puller.

TwoXJS

I just found a puller on O'Rielly's website I could get tomorrow that should work. Shaped like a claw with a bolt in the middle? And what did you mean by "inducing bumpsteer"? I know I have the death wobble and I think I've heard it reffered to as bump steer.

SteveMongr

Yes, that sounds like it. Some pullers can be used for multiple things, but not the pitman puller. Seems to only fit a pitman arm.
Bump-Steer and Death-Wobble are two different things.
BS is due to the draglink and trackbar being out of parallel. When a bump in the road is hit, the steering wheel turns a bit and the jeep does not track straight.

DW is an oscillation of the axle and suspension, triggered by a bump. Feels like you have lost control and are about to crash. This is due to loose or worn parts, especially the trackbar, bracket and bushings (also control arm bushings).

Roadking_

My DW in 94 Cherokee was solved by replacing the shimmy dampner. The sideways shock absorber that connects to the long steering link, and over by the passenger side front hub. Careful tho, the shaft that goes thru the steering link is tapered. I had to heat mine up to get it out. But now when I drive over RR tracks I dont feel like the steering wheel is going to jump out of my hands!

SteveMongr

^ A new steering damper can mask death wobble or loose steering parts, not fix it. With front end in good shape, the jeep can be driven without the damper and no ill effects. It's a creature comfort that helps when going over RR tracks and the like.

To remove tapered bolts use the 'two hammer technique'. Simultaneously strike both sides of where the tapered bolt is located. Not at all hard, just firmly. Bolt will literally fall or pop out. Keep the castle nut on a few threads to keep part from falling to floor.
Works on steering knuckles, drag-link (steering dampener), and removing drag-link from pitman arm. Because the bolt and hole is tapered, the 'strike' forces it to unseat.

TwoXJS

Steve, I firmly believe what I have now is in fact bump steer. If I hit a good enough bump, it does seem like the wheel moves out of alignment or something. I also thought I had death wobble (still might, don't know), but that seemed to have been caused by my tired mind forgetting to torque my wheel spacer nuts on the front end.

Took the tires off to rotate them today and immediately saw one nut was up at a weird angle on the stud, the others were quite loose and the entire spacer moved independent of the rotor. Fixed it though, seems to drive like a dream! No more shaking feeling at 45-50! Only time will tell if the DW is still there....I recently torqued and LocTite'ed the track bar bolt on the axle end and it doesn't seem to have moved any....

Back on the original topic, do you think the new pitman arm I got will help with the bump steer? It's got about a full inch of drop versus the stock one.

SteveMongr

Spacers need upkeep. And locktite. I run one inch hub-centric and wheel-centric spacers. Even if loose, they stay centered. Also removes the load of vehicle from the lug bolts, keeps it on hubs.
Did anything change in the steering system or track-bar? Did the track-bar come with a bracket for frame-side? A drop pitman would be to match a dropped track-bar. To keep the end-point angles parallel.
I tried the ZJ pitman (to reduce steering angles) with my 4.5" lift, stock steering, RockKrawler track-bar. It caused bumpsteer.

Look at your front end, imagine a straight line from bolt-to-bolt (pivot to pivot) of the track bar. Same with the draglink. Those lines should be perfectly parallel. The farther out of parallel, the worse bumpsteer is. Some use a string to help picture the lines.
Then decide which way to go.

TwoXJS

Only thing that's changed recently with the steering/suspension is a new TRE on the driver side knuckle. Track bar is still stock despite that fact I know I need a new one, but money's in the way of that....I'll take a look at the angles underneath you mentioned and maybe snap a picture to let you see how it is.

SteveMongr

At 3.5" lift, stock steering and trackbar, the angles should not be an issue. More likely other worn parts in the steering system or worn control arm bushings.
Improper caster (alignment) settings for a lifted jeep can also contribute to bumpsteer.
Did you do an alignment after lifting?
The easiest way to find worn steering parts is have someone keep turning the steering wheel back and forth just until it starts turning tires. You watch the front end, look at every joint and bushing, look for play or slop or anything that shifts. There should be none..

TwoXJS

Did not get an alignment after the lift, so I'm guessing it'll need that. Can a shop adjust the caster on a lifted vehicle? I thought that wasn't changeable without adjustable control arms? I could be wrong, so please excuse me....I'll get out later this evening after it cools off and have my brother turn the wheel while I check for slack

SteveMongr

IF you are lifted 3.5" and are running stock upper and lower arms, then that is your problem.. Shims will not remedy it. The lower arms need to be longer than shims will accommodate.

Shims can be placed behind the control arms, used for caster adjustments. This is how it's done stock and can also be used when lifted and with longer non-adjustable arms.

Since the only adjustments are caster and toe, the alignment can be done at home with an angle finder and measuring tape. And with 'stringing', an adjustable trackbar can be set and thrust angle can be checked.
http://go.jeep-xj.info/HowtoAlignment.htm
http://www.circletrack.com/chassiste...ring_your_car/

The problem with alignment shops is they do not take the lift into consideration, they just go by the book, which can give fair results at 3.5" lift. But any higher and it's pinion angle that takes priority over caster.
Your bumpsteer issues are most certainly attributed to the alignment (caster & toe) and the fact that the control arms now sit at a downward angle due to the lift. Ideally they should be horizontal aka neutral like stock. That increased angle causes the 'road' to come up and into the chassis, the angle also affects steering and needs to be compensated for..