SeniorXJ

-Ok so those that know my botched steering thread, https://www.cherokeeforum.com/f67/bo...what-do-99935/, know that a mechanic told me 15 times that i need to run a steering stabilizer to reduce my death wabble. Since this is NOT the proper way to fix DW, i thought it would be a good idea to compose a thread filled with facts, opinions, & personal experiences that i can later print up.

-What id like to see here is to have as many people reply with ur .02 cents, ur personal knowlege, the setups ur runnin, & post up links to other good threads on this "beat to death topic", just so i have as much traction in court tryin to explain things like "death wabble" & what a stabilizers job actualy is.

-My personal take on this is that a properly installed steering system should not need a stabilizer & that stabilizers only mask the underlying problem & can actualy leave u worse off as the real problem still exists!!

((Edited to death wabble so sorry for the confusion))

ericfx1984

before I get started... flame suit ON!!!

skip to the last paragraph for the skinny

I have a 1996 Jeep Cherokee Sport

I am on 4.5" of lift (closer to 5.5... thanks to RC... if I wanted 5.5 I would have got 5.5)

I needed to address the track bar... so I took the OEM replacement track bar that I picked up new for $35 a few months back and cut the TRE off... then I cut the bushing off my old track bar... (burned the bushing out) welded it where the TRE used to be and reinforced it as well... then installed a Energy Suspension track bar bushing... the neato thing about that is it increases the trackbar bolt size to 7/16... not a huge increase but still and increase... I plan to add one to the other size soon enough... I may even punch the bushing sleeve out to 1/2"

then I cut up the stock track bar mount on the 'frame' and turned it into a double shear mount... I made the trackbar mount a little lower on the frame side to help with clearance on the axle side...

then I removed the stabilizer and cut the stabilzer bracket off... and started cutting and grinding the axle side mount... now I have almost as much clearance as when the Jeep was OEM...

then I plated the axle side track bar mount with 1/4" plate... Overkill much? yes... but I USED WHAT I HAD LAYING AROUND

I added a ZJ pitman arm (1" drop) and bought the track bar up in place and played with it a while to compare angles between the track bar and the drag link... in my caes I found that lowering the track bar 1.5" roughly gave me the best angles

I run NO stabilizer and I have NO bump steer, no death wobble and no problems in general. Bump steer is caused by mismatched drag link and track bar angles... basically you need to setup your steering first then adjust your height on the track bar to keep then parallel... do this and you will not need a stabilizer

ericfx1984

http://www.naxja.org/html/techarticl...psteertech.htm

SeniorXJ

-Lets try to resist the temptation of flaming here cauz i wanna use this as a way to show a "judge" that this guys idea of a solution to bump steer was to run a stabilizer instead of fixin it the right way. Trust me ive explained this to the guy 15 times that his botched workmanship is the real cauz!!

-Oh & u really dont need to go in full detail on setups so maybe i should edit that or just say make it short & sweet. Like i said, i want a thread with honest replies backing my "last" paragraph up. Concider it me asking for a favor to beat the dead horse a bit more!! LoL

jmm0122

As you stated you don't need a steering stabilizer if everything is lined up perfectly in the front. Most people run them but they aren't really needed. Guess thats my .02 cents

ericfx1984

that's why I gave the condensed version in the last paragraph...

SeniorXJ

Yeah maybe this wasnt the greatest of thread ideas as i can just print out other discussions, but what i had it in mind was that if the comments were addressed to me or are in MY thread, it would look better.

N20jeep

steering stabilizer will have no effect on bumpsteer.

you could run 6 stabilizers and still have bumpsteer.

as addressed in your other thread, the steering/ trac bar angles need to be matched to correct bumpsteer.

good luck

N20jeep

steering stabilizer will have no effect on bumpsteer.

you could run 6 stabilizers and still have bumpsteer.

as addressed in your other thread, the steering/ trac bar angles need to be matched to correct bumpsteer.

good luck

MuscleHead

No offense but i doubt educating yourself on this for court is going to help you any at all. You are not a professional is this field so they wont see what your saying as fact where as if you took a professional mechanic with experience in the subject they would. The professional would be able to state his profession and experience in court to pack up his facts.

SeniorXJ

My bad, i ment death wabble!!

SeniorXJ

-Correct, but the more evidence in my favor the better the case. Remember this is small claims court so theres no lawyers & its a more relaxed setting. My job is to convince the judge that my case is correct & while i have the odds tipped in my favor like my jeep being towed back to his shop, I KNOW one of the 1st things out of his mouth is gonna be him telling the judge that I NEED a stabilizer & then I NEED to shoot his theory down of the porpose of that stabilizer theory defence!!

Does that sound better of what im askin for in this thread??

SeniorXJ

Can we get some more comments on how stabilizers mask underlining problems & are just band-aids plz?? Like i said in the begining, i know the answers but i just wanna get more people to post up that agree with me since its the truth!! Remember i have to rebuttal the shop owners claim that a steering stabilizer will fix all problems!!

_StationWagon_

Well, you might want to have an argument to explain to the judge why there is a steering stabilizer included from the factory when everything is lined up perfectly to begin with. The arguments you are offering, while possibly valid, will crumble if your opposing party points out that every factory XJ has one.

Also, I would suggest you get pictures of people running no stabilizers & their matching testimonials. No offence, but a Judge might not be so sympathetic to a guy who modified his vehicle & wants to eliminate what appears to be "safety" stabilizing equipment, when an experienced mechanic advises against doing so.

Bear in mind that unsubstantiated claims by amateurs on a forum won't hold a lot of weight with any judge worth his pay. To him they will be just opinions, not facts ... unless there are pics & sworn testimonials. A few statements from 4x4 suspension professionals would also carry more weight than anything you get here. Just because you believe in CF doesn't mean everyone does.

SeniorXJ

Well thanks alot for killin the thread for me!!! This is "small claims court" where there are NO lawyers & the atmosphere is relaxed & most cases are one persons word against anothers, SO basically the person who presents the strongest case wins & thats what i was tryin to do here.

You DONT need to be a cerified technician to proove my case cause if i have 20 people sayin that theres no need for a stabilizer on a modified jeep then the odds heavily favor my side!! Posting what u said fits more into a law suit setting where id be goin after him for lots more money & somethin like personal injuries where cold facts are neccessary!!

The fact that the jeep comes with a stabilizer in its stock form is in MY favor because this is NOT a stock jeep & once u have as much modifications as i do, the stabilizer is no longer neccessary or needed!!

Well whatever dude, the thread is dead now & suits no purpose since the ONLY purpose was to gather up as many people as possible to state the obviouse & thats that no one uses stabilizers past a certian point in modifications...