77olds

As an auto technician, some of the advice I see passed around on this site irks me.

It's not out of a sense of pride or hierarchy, it's because there are some people that really should not be advising others on repairs.

Obviously there is a wealth of GOOD information on these forums and those giving out the bad advice are the exception, NOT the rule, however there are many self-proclaimed experts here who are very convincing and forceful in their suggestions.

A lot of people come here to learn and it bothers me that they might be "learning" from the wrong people.

Now, I'm not saying that you should ONLY listen to professional mechanics - there are plenty of people who are just as good, if not BETTER mechanics than your typical certified technician - BUT, there are more than enough shade tree mechanics who suggest "repairs" or "mods" that are not only wrong, but sometimes unsafe.

Just recently I saw a thread concerning death wobble in which a poster made it QUITE clear that it's NOT THE STEERING STABILIZER and that replacing the stabilizer just masks a larger problem so don't do it because you'll be stupid if you do... then his very next piece of advice was to adjust the alignment for more toe-in because "sometimes that helps". Yeah, and it's WRONG.

He literally just made a big deal about how replacing a worn steering stabilizer was a stupid idea, and then suggested adjusting the alignment out of spec to fix death wobble "the redneck way".

This is terrible advice.

I've also seen MANY times, people suggesting that you should just remove your sway bars altogether because "i can drive fine without mine". Maybe. Maybe they can. But I have to ask, why are the sway bars there in the first place if they're not important? I also have the ask, when is the last time you had to make a sudden, sharp maneuver at a high speed to avoid an accident? I can't help but imagine that the lack of a sway bar might be in issue in such a situation.

To someone who understands the purpose of a sway bar, this is a no-brainer... but still, even some experienced Jeepers claim that you just don't need your sway bars. I have to say to them that giving that type of advice is immoral.

In the past I've tried appealing to the advice givers, requesting that they phrase their advice more carefully or at least add more information so that the advice-seeker could make a more educated decision, but that never worked...

So now I'm just cautioning advice seekers. Do not blindly trust the advice you read here. Corroborate it with other advice, do tandem research (ask for advice here, google that advice, etc) to ensure that the person who responded to you isn't full of crap.

I could go on here but really the point is this: Don't trust a random internet person to give you professional mechanical advice. Not everyone here knows what they're talking about.

Sorry if I've ruffled feathers by saying this, but it needed to be said.

94XjSport94

I agree with parts of this.


Stabilizer... Do you need one? No. That's a fact. It dampens impacts and movements in the steering right? It'll help hide DW compared to fixing the source.

Sway bars... I don't run them. I tell other people to drive and see how their Jeep handles before making a decision. Their Jeep, their rules.

Threads concerning both topics always get blown out of proportion though. Always.

Atmos

Youre majorly stirring the pot here. I agree with the safety in modification but you're attacking the wrong areas. You may understand the stock replacement/maintenance of a vehicle but you seem to be lacking understanding when it comes to modification.

Flame bad information as you see it please. People will develop their own poor reputations
Such as myself

wiggles

Usually the people that give bad info are easy to identify because of the idiotic things they say.

Property set up steering doesn't need a stablizer

I too usually suggest people try out no sway bars, I have none and have made several emergency maneuvers. On my way home from work tonight I was even drifting... 4.5" with 33's
Its knowing how your rig will react

V8XJDavid

Problem is, most people just don't know how to drive. Most people NEED the sway bar because they either haven't learned how to actually drive, or they don't understand how their Jeep operates. It ain't a sports car and it will not handle like one sway bar or no sway bar. However, if you are a seasoned driver who really knows how to drive and knows his vehicle, you can be as safe without it. Sway bars and stuff like that are there to make the vehicle safer for the average driver. And, yes, for the expert driver too, however the need for it decreases with your experience. Just my two cents.

BKohs

So you're saying the laws od physics change based on the driver's experience? I'm not suggesting you'll absolutely flip the jeep for running it without sway bars, but running without them does greatly increase your chances of flipping it no matter how much experience you have.

V8XJDavid

What I'm saying is, if you are a truly good driver and you know your vehicle and it's limitations/strengths, you'll be much more able to overcome whatever is going to come at you. Yes, under certain circumstances even the best driver will lose control. However the chances of that happening diminish tremendously with a person who remains focused and knows his vehicle. I would wager we've all seen morons on the trail who get their (or another) rig damaged because they just weren't good at driving. And an experienced, good driver would navigate the exact same track without a problem.

Dan91

You know, when you add lift most people will also add track width with wider tires and higher backspaced wheels. Also it's worth mentioning that the spring rates on lift kits are quite a bit stiffer than stock. These things make a difference in emergency maneuvers. I ran a stock ZJ with no sway bars for a while...it was like driving a boat, body roll was insane. My XJ is lifted 4" and on 33s with no sway bars, and it actually handles quite nicely. Point is, the amount of difference it makes also has a lot to do with how the vehicle is set up.

BKohs

I'll agree, you get much better trail performance with out them, but on a highway, it's not the safest thing to do. If you're doing 70-80mph and have to swerve quick, you'll wish there were sway bars in there to help you out. I dont care if you want to endanger yourself. That is your choice to make, but taking them out puts the people around you in danger which is why I wont be taking mine out. I'll use discos instead.

BKohs

I completely understand that and agree. A lot of things depend on how your rig is set up, but the issue is telling people that taking them out is ok, but not considering their set up. If someone has a cheap 3"-4" lift and 31's on stock wheels, it's gonna feel quite unstable while maneuvering at highway speeds. I'll go back to what the OP said. People need to carefully word [and think about] the advice they are giving on here.

SoCalxJ4.0

Eh, don't drive your jeep 80. Don't follow to close behind another vehicle. Don't slam brakes in the middle of a turn, don't slam brakes on ice or water. I had a pre-runner I could throw up on 3 wheels on turns, and now I have a jeep with no sway bars. Haven't seen a unicorn fall out of the sky yet, and I'm still alive. Craziness. Oh common sense and a five speed helps a lot!! =P

motorcharge

Complains about bad advice, creates thread giving bad advice.

JeepingDan

I don't follow text book procedures when it comes to repairs because I don't like to spend all day replacing an alternator. I like my short cuts.

DieselD

IMO if you're taking just one persons advice as truth ON THE iNTERNET then you're probably not the brightest person anyways. Maybe just too trustworthy. If 35 people give you the same advice, maybe it'd be worth considering.

I don't think it needed to be said, it usually gets said in each thread where bad advice exists.

As far as sway bars go, if you installed HD springs, stiff white body shocks, and maxed out your stock LCA's travel... you probably won't have the same kind of body roll as you did with the squishy old springs and worn out shocks.

Now if you have long arms, bilsteins softer springs and more articulation then you may NEED a sway bar. That's why you get mixed opinions. Everybody's suspension is different once it starts getting modified.

EDIT: someone pretty much said exactly what I said already. Lol.

BatmanXJ

IMO: Removing the sway-bar can be considered safer if you look at it in a different light. I understand exactly what the sway bar does and what are possible effects of removing it. However, As i know the effects it has made me a more cautious driver which in return makes it more safe than having the sway on there. I would be willing to be the number of rollovers that occur because the sway bar has been removed would be quite low. Most roll overs are because the driver was at error. If the driver knows the jeep is susceptible to a roll over the probability of said person driving more safe would be higher. I am not saying that everyone should remove theirs. I still that when people pose the question of weather to remove it or not that both sides of the argument should chime in. The the person asking the question can make up their own mind. I personally don't drive my jeep on the street very much and when I do I'm not planning on going fast.

As far as advice goes. It's the internet if a reader believes everything on their screen then it wouldn't matter what advice they were given. Bad advice is just as important as good advice in many cases. The bad advice will make a more knowledgeable person respond and give the OP the correct advice more because they are trying to reverse the bad advice. That same expert may not have posted anything to a question if bad advice had not been given. Proly never thought about it that way did ya?

Everything can be looked at from multiple angles no matter which is right or which is wrong.