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Stock Grand Cherokee Tech. All ZJ/WJ/WK Non-modified/stock questions go here!ZJ (93-98), WJ (99-04), WK (05+)
All ZJ/WJ/WK specific tech questions asked here!
I've got a 99 grand Cherokee that is not worth fixing, 2wd, you can see in previous posts all the time I wasted on it, it is a shame, it's decent, just no time or money to do anything with it. So I am stealing parts off of it for my 97 4x4.
So far I need the exhaust to the cat, the master cylinder, and probably some other stuff just to keep. The master cylinder will not bolt on directly, but it looks identical in the cylinder measurements. I am looking at changing the entire brake booster out and if that doesn't measure up right, trading the guts to the actual master cylinder itself. Don't know if either will work but I'm going to try it.
The exhaust looks like a direct bolt on if I take the manifolds as well, but the pipe looks bigger, so I may need to put an adapter in somewhere, but it should flow better anyway, I just need the cat since mine is broke off in front. It's a bigger better flowing cat as well, it looks like.
I already have a 99 intake I have planned on installing, in this case I will have an extra and a whole jeep to use as upgrade or install parts.
I am going to try to get the electric fan as well and anything else I can use on my 97, any advice or info would be greatly appreciated, and I will be selling parts if anyone wants them. cheap, but has to cost something since it will take time and weight away from when I scrap this thing.
got the exhaust off, and the brake booster, had a long post written about all things including AC system, accessories, control arms, fuel pump, and other stuff, then lost it due to the site blanking out, I think I'm invisible on here anyway, people that have shops and make money from people must not like that I try to find affordable solutions. Trust me I would prefer to just throw money around to someone with a good honest shop with proper tooling, but right now I can't. And finding an honest shop is a problem too, so many people try to rack up charges as if you are a retard just because you want to pay them to do some work. Then you have to worry if they sabotage your vehicle for future work, lol.
No, you're not invisible here. I'm just concerned you're going to get into a lot of problems trying the retro-fit WJ parts on your ZJ. The control arms are a good fit and are stronger than the ZJ's. The intake is a good fit although it's larger and may be a tight fit between the fenderwell. The exhaust may not line up with the ports well because they changed the head in '99, but you can check that by trying a ZJ gasket against it. Also, the WJ has two 02 sensors in the split pipes after the dual cats. You could probably get away with using just one of them.
The brake system on the WJ uses dual piston front calipers so the fluid delivery has to be larger. I think you will have problems using any of the WJ's brake parts on your ZJ.
One thing that will fit are the front seats, IF you unbolt them from their bases. There are 4 nuts on studs that bolt the cushion sections to the bases. The bases don't interchange with the ZJ because the floor pan is different.
About the mechanic. I lucked out because I found a guy who's a classic car nut and likes working on cars. He started with neighbors and friends and worked his business up to be very popular with older people. He only charges $65/hour and lets me buy my own parts. His shop is back off the road and he doesn't have a sign out, but he has enough work to get overwhelmed at times. I asked him why he's still working on cars because he's as old as I am and he said "It keeps me from going nuts." If he sold his shop and all his classic cars, he could live the rest of his life with no worries.
Hey thanks for that reply, yeah the control arm is better made for sure, I was hoping it would be slightly longer than the ZJ's so it would be a cheap lift component, I haven't got to measuring them yet. With the exhaust, on this particular 99, there are not dual cats, and only one upstream O2 sensor and one downstream. I hope like heck the exhaust manifold bolts up, and the ZJ intake is actually longer towards the fender well than the WJ's, it seems anyway. One way or another I am using that cat though, I have to somehow, even if I have to cut and scab it, the pipe is bigger throughout the entire run also.
The actual master cylinder looks the same other than the mounting "flange" , it has the same diameter on the outside and the same length, but the guts could be different. For sure it goes into a different system after the master cylinder. Hopefully the radiator can be used with the shroud to direct fit the electric fan. I can see for sure it has been altered somewhat though from the zj to the wj.
Oh and I am stuck getting my old cat separated from the new muffler I put on last year. I did it to last and used exhaust cement in the joint between the two, just a little so it would never leak or come loose, I did not foresee the cat being so bad it would break off in the front, lol.
I am hoping I can get the manifolds to work, I will match up the gaskets like you said. The 99 was easier to get to than the the 97 as far as the bolts and such, will the valve cover gasket work since the head had been changed? And if I were to switch the brake calipers over is that a possibility? It would be so nice to discover a small edge or cheap solution here, I know things don't always just work out , believe me lol. How about the fuel pump? I know the injectors are different, they seem bigger on the 97 and have a better plug that is different. And what about the air breather? it seems different on the 99, better flowing. I think I'm over the open filter aftermarket designs , once I learned or actually thought about the air temp and density of air.
Back to the exhaust, the 97 stock exhaust could rival any aftermarket header by looks, but the 99 is obviously going into a bigger downpipe, and there are two pipes coming down. into a better collector, if only I had a good shop to weld and stuff, hopefully it just fits. I'm not sure what you are talking about with the dual cats unless it's a later change or California emissions. So now I get to take my cut off wheel and cut the old cat off my new muffler, and find a way to get the piece out of there to install the new bigger cat from the 99 hopefully with the complete exhaust from the header down. I guess I can cut it close and start a slit longways in the remaining pipe, and use my spud wrench in the O2 sensor bung to get the pipe to crush inward to loosen it. I like doing stuff with vehicles, but problem after problem after problems gets so frustrating, even if they are self induced , lol
Are accessories worth keeping? The AC compressor is mounted opposite on the two, and the alternator looks the same, but I don't want to fry a computer or something. the power steering pump looks the same so far. The seats are better in the 99 but wrong color and cloth not leather. If I ever hit the lotto I am for sure going to build a shop and hire good employees to work on my ideas, and research and try stuff, not saying others aren't already doing this , but I would try to do it also. Can the dual caliper brakes be switched over? again completely different system but I would try it if it bolts up. I'm not sure why jeep made so many changes in them years , there was no real improvement in performance or am I wrong?
Okay, My WJ was built for the NY market and I've been told it has the CA emission package. IDK for sure, but it doesn't have a large cat under the floor like my '97 ZJ did. The intake stands out from the head farther than the ZJ's did, and there was only about 3" or less between the fender and the manifold on my ZJ, but many guys are using the WJ intake on the ZJs so it must fit okay.
The brake calipers are another story. They mount on the steering knuckle (spindle carrier) on a removable bracket with 2 large bolts. This bracket has to be removed before you can take off the rotor. When installing brake pads, the outer pads is placed on the bracket, the inner pad clips into the pistons, then the caliper is placed onto the bracket, held in place with the 2 slide pins. They are physically larger than the ZJs and I believe the rotors are also PLUS the wheel bolt pattern is 5X5 rather then your ZJs 5X4.5 and uses 16" wheels to clear the calipers. Some people tell me 15" wheels will fit the WJ, but they have to be custom aftermarket wheels or use adapters/spacers. I have the Teves calipers and some have Akabono calipers which are smaller and IDK how they mount. The whole reason for the brake change was the heavier curb weight of the WJ. Mine tips the scale at 3980 lbs. The rear brakes are only single piston but I think the rotors are larger also. I WILL say that with 1/2 ton of newspapers aboard, it still stops pretty well. I just have to remember to start braking sooner, as with any heavy load.
On removing the muffler, I've taken the inner section of pipe out by starting a slit with a Dremel cut-off wheel, then put a pair of Vise-Grips on one side, an adjustable wrench over them, and twisted, collapsing the inner pipe. My mufflers are usually mounted with clamps, so they have a crush ring that I remove with an expander. Sometimes you can rent them.
I think the alternator will work fine, as long as the wiring is the same. The regulator is in the PCM. IDK about the A/C compressor, but you can check part numbers.
Gotta go, something else needs my attention. Be right back!
I'm Baaacckkk!!! You mentioned performance? Well, Chrysler wanted more power out of the 4.0 so made several changes to it for this purpose. The made the air filter and ducting larger, made a water pump with a special slotted impeller to decrease drag, went to an electric cooling fan and removed the clutch fan for the same reason. They then changed the size of the valve ports in the head for better flow and also improved the intake manifold. They changed the cam profile to make max torque at 4000 instead of 3000 rpm and max hp at 4500. All this massaging resulted in a whopping 10 hp increase! AND their new 0331 head started developing cracks! Chrysler never recognized they had a problem with this head, but amazingly, they recast it for 2002. the new casting has a "TUPY" stamped in it.
BTW, your valve covers are the same, although IDK why you'd want to change it.
Did I mention the block changes? In order to fit the 4.7 V8 into the WJ, the motor mount locations had to be changed to balance the engine, resulting in changing the mount locations on the 4.0 block! In order to change that, the oil pump/filter got in the way and had to be relocated. They put the filter on the oil gallery high on the side of the block and the oil pressure sensor farther back. The oil filter is the easiest way to identify the older engines from the newer ones.
The seats. My driver's seat thigh bolster on the door side was collapsing from getting in and out and was uncomfortable anyway for me because it was pinching a nerve in my hip. I opted for an XJ seat because it was flat and fit my butt better. It's a high backed one in a fawn color and I'm looking for a pair of ZJ seats in grey fabric for the final swap. The seats were only $15 each at my You Pull,You Save. There was a $2 core charge, for whatever reason. What I found amusing was LEATHER seats were only $15 also, although they are the first to go.
That's about all I've got unless you can think about something else.
Hey thanks guys, but are you sure about the wheel bolt pattern change? I have a set of 16's on my 97 right now, since I once got a good deal on them with good tires. And with that cat pipe being stuck in the muffler, that was a b@#$%h to get out, I had used exhaust cement since I planned on never taking it off again, I did use a saws all to cut a slit in it , but mangled up my almost new muffler end in the process, that exhaust cement held like it said it would. And after reading about the head problem from the 99, and seeing what that exhaust cement looks like when cured , I can tell that the head had been cracked on the 99 and some idiot used exhaust cement on it to try to fix it, which caused the clogging and probably the rod bearing to go, even though I would have thought a main would go first. That engine was full of red sandy stuff , and I want to take the brand new valve cover gasket I just put on it and use it on my 97 since it has a minor leak. And my 97's brakes are fine , I was just exploring options to get something out of that 99 so it isn't a total loss, and with the changes they made to get more power, I don't see that as an improvement for this type of vehicle, who runs around at 4,000 RPM's anyway? I just can't see being in the woods or on the trail using RPM's that high without wrecking somehow lol. I guess if you mud bog that would be different. Or race on a course or something. I need to get with an AC guy to get the Freon removed, I don't want a 5,000 dollar fine or to hurt the environment by just letting it go. I am going to try to use the air breather set up though, and everything else I can. It was easier getting the intake off of the 99 than I was on the 97, just access to a few bolts were harder for me at least, and the tranny filler tube is blocking the rear exhaust manifold stud, so that's a tedious problem. I did not know the block had changed, that's interesting. All for a 4.7 engine, that was also a folly lol
Oh and you must be a distributor for carriers for the newspaper, I was a paperboy, at 8 yrs of age, I remember they had to bend the rules to let me do it. Times sure were different, now adults do kids jobs, even grass mowing, but you know with the both parents having to work these days and everyone being immigrant crazy people need to scrape for jobs. I can truly say I worked since I was 8 yrs old, still looking for my American dream and reward for my hard work, lol. I guess I have to inherit a bunch of money to invest in things that are artificial and that the government will use tax money from people like me to bail me out when the fake system get's pushed past it's limits to be a hard worker. But yeah don't mean to get political, I know it isn't the right place , thanks again for the advice and help
oh yeah I plan on getting the radiator and electric fan, but this jeep has a clutch fan as well. the electric fan seems to be factory since the plug goes into the stock harness, so what do I need to rob from the 99 to make this fan work on the 97? or is it in the computer?
Damn it!! I just lost a long post somehow before I finished it. Quickly to restate it.
I have a motor route, drive by and chuck it in the mailboxes. I guess you could say I'm a carrier that works for a distributor. 375 Sunday papers=approx 1500 lbs. Right now there are a lot of Ukrainians delivering the paper in the city. Most of them understand little English. IDK how they manage.
The electric fan is controlled by the PCM thru a special relay, but all you need is a temperature switch to activate it. I can give you a rundown of how the factory control works, I just did but lost it.
The WJ was designed to appeal to the public that wanted a road car capable of off road usage instead of an off road car capable of being a daily driver like the ZJ is. The stress was on highway comfort rather than bashing around on dirt roads. Take a look at all the other SUVs out there today. They all look the same. This is what I did to mine; (How did I wind up with double pics?)
I remember every customer had something special I had to do with their paper, put it in a door, or under a mat or in a mailbox etc. I think I got bit by dogs around 3 times chased several more, lol. And if I messed up I would get a scolding from the district manager, not missing a delivery but just not doing their special request. I had approximately 100 papers on my route, a few more sunday only. Then I had to run around and collect money, with people being quiet pretending to not be home or having kids answer the door, it's good that kids can't do it anymore, when I think of making between 80 to 100 a month and all the time and effort it was far less than $1 an hour. When it hit below zero in ohio my dad would drive us on sundays, he probably lost money on gas. Luckily at the time the paper was an evening paper and not morning, besides sunday. And I don't really have a problem with immigrants so much, but illegals that can now flaunt and jeer about it I do, and the fact that they cry discrimination if you even want them to communicate properly. I had business with the post office the other day, a latino answered the phone, I ask for his supervisor or someone that can speak English better since it was important business for me, and he accused me of discrimination and cussed at me, unbelievable. And as far as work goes , they are exempt somehow from the long background checks and employment history or any of the stuff the average citizen has to comply with , therefore they get favoritism, and they make the same money, not one penny less, and with safety rules and constantly being under threat of losing your job, you have to work with or next to someone that has no idea what is going on since they can't communicate or are simply exempt from that also. As an electrician they are in that field also, we go to power up transformers with high voltage, 4160, and I think 7600 or something like that , and a wrong building may come online, I saw a fellow electrician get a cart of drywall tipped over on him , he got hurt, then got fired for it, the nitwits had nothing at all said to them.
But yeah that is a nice jeep, and I have lost posts and pics on here before and just gave up. And the ZJ really is a good off road and very comfortable on the road as well. I never liked SUV's until I got that grand Cherokee , now I'm hooked, lol. And the grand Cherokee just feels so solid and stable compared to the GM or ford version, I won't even consider riding in the Asian tip over mobiles, haven't had the privilege of being in a Mercedes or BMW or range rover, but as I understand the jeep beat the range rover but lost anyway due to prestige or resale value, or something that had no bearing on the performance tests. But yeah I'm sorta confused on the electric fan in combination with the clutch fan, and plan to use the electric fan alone on my zj, to gain some power and gas mileage, if it is enough to do the job.
Last edited by munyanb; 08-09-2015 at 10:27 AM.
Reason: forgot something
What jeep has going for it is the 2 live axle platform. Yes, it's archaic, but it handles better than IFS. As my dad said, "Rides like a rocking horse, corners like a couch!" It does pitch a bit front to rear if the shocks are bad, but it corners flat with little body roll. To me, it feels more solid on the road than my Camaro did.
The electric fan will be more than adequate. Mine doesn't come on 'til the temp gets to 215*, comes on high, then reduces to low speed at 200* and stays running on low until you shut off the engine. It will kick back to high if the temp goes up again, like when you stop in traffic. The speeds are controlled by a pulse-modulated relay keyed by the PCM reading the temp gauge. There are aftermarket systems that do the same thing or you can just rig it to turn on and off with a temp switch and a relay because it draws about 30 amps. You could just rig it to run on high and use your clutch fan for the lower speed.
As I said, my paper route is a "Motor Route" which means I don't get out of the car unless the customer wants it on his porch and I only do that for a few old people or the disabled. All the billing is done by the main office and I get paid by my boss. We only deliver one paper per day and only 3 days a week. I made $12000 last year plus tips and holiday gifts. I also busted 4 foot snow drifts in the bitter cold last year. Gotta have a Jeep! The major problem with that is double-bagging and tossing them for the people that don't plow out their mailboxes. Try driving around with a -30* windchill with the window open.
Yeah, I get kinda upset when I have to talk on the phone with some IT nitwit from Microsoft or someplace trying to understand what he's saying thru both the accent AND the IT babble!
Well I was calling the post office, which is a taxpayer funded service, not just a private business, although they may as well be taxpayer funded, lol. It also involved matters of national security and official business. I had some douche the other day try to claim jeeps are tippers, what an idiot, he was trying to talk me down on selling that junk 99. He was telling me he got an 05 overland for 500 that ran and drove just fine, maybe he did rip some ederly person off or something, I understand business, but like the British say, just don't take the **** out of it.
08-06-2015, 02:11 PM
parts swapping
