GOTWAX

I recently replaced my steering box, and now that everything is back together it feels like I have no power steering, the pump is less than 6 months old could it be bad already? Or could I have air in the lines? Any help is appreciated

Radi

Did you bleed everything out? 10-15 turns from one lock to the other, check fluid, repeat.

GOTWAX

No didn't do it that many times, ill try tomorrow when I can Jack up the front.

Firestorm500

Loosen up the preload on the box a little.

GOTWAX

Preload?

Radi

The adjustment on top of the box. Loosen the locknut while holding the center screw in place. Try turning the center screw counter-clockwise 1/4 turn, then while still holding it in place, tighten the locknut again. See if that helps.
If it does, keep turning counter clockwise in small increments and testing the steering until the steering feels right. If you start to get some slop you've gone too far.

The truth of the matter is a good number of these 'rebuilt' steering boxes have worn out internals. The rebuilders sometimes tighten the heck out of that preload to get the slop out, but that causes the box to bind and die an early death. That may or may not be what's happening but it's certainly worth checking out.

Demonoid369

That's usually not advised because once you do that, your box can never go back and you could make it worse

Radi

The second part is very true. You won't harm anything by loosening the preload a bit at risk of having sloppy steering, but overtightening can destroy the box.

What do you mean by 'never go back'? Warranty issues? Might have a point there if the terms prohibit adjusting the box. I've taken them back after opening them up and finding worn-out gear sets, but YMMV of course.

GOTWAX

I think the pump is bad. Jacked up the front or turned fine. Went lock to lock a bunch of times, loosened up a good amount and took it for a drive but the steering got stiff again. And is back to what it was.

Demonoid369

What I meant by never go back is that you'll never get it back to normal. Once you start turning, that setting is lost as far as I've read and learned about steering boxes. As far as I know, turning that should be a last option kind of thing. I could be wrong but hopefully someone like cruiser54 could clarify for us.

Radi

I've worked on these Saginaw boxes since the late '70's. It's perhaps the most common steering gear ever made. I'll tell what I know about that adjustment, others are welcome to verify or disagree as appropriate. Perhaps it'll help others understand the steering gear a little better and dispel some misconceptions.



The adjustment is there with the intent it be used from time to time to compensate for gear wear, as is the other adjustment- the input bearing preload on the input side of the box.
It isn't dangerous to adjust unless someone sets it too tight, in which case it'll cause very rapid gear wear- or in some cases blow the top off the box or crack the houing when the wheel is centered.

The gearset is designed with a high spot on center to improve straight-ahead road feel and accuracy, thus on-center is the first thing to bind up if it's too tight. That's the first clue an adjustment has gone too far- the steering binds on center, won't stay centered or won't return to center after turning.
Any adjustment should therefore be made in small increments, with the steering centered and a careful test drive following.

The by-the-book way to do it is to pull the box, put it in a vice and rock the input shaft through the center position with an inch/lb dial-type torque wrench. The torque required to rotate the shaft should increase on-center by a certain amount- IIRC 5-6 in/lb - over the torque to rotate the shaft off-center.
Some guys have done it by disconnecting the pitman and pulling the steering wheel through center with a fishing scale. I guess that's better than guessing.
In reality owners have been adjusting these boxes by feel for decades, a fraction of a turn at a time until the slop improves. If the box binds before the slop is removed, it has to be rebuilt. You can come acceptably close to the correct adjustment this way if you are careful and observant.
If you aren't comfortable doing this or aren't sure what to look for, by all means- don't. Have a shop do it.

The trick to getting repeatable settings BTW is to always end the adjustment by turning the preload clockwise.
If you need to loosen it 1/4 turn, you want to first loosen it 1/2 turn CCW, then tighten 1/4 turn CW.
If you have completely lost the setting: center the wheel, turn the adjuster fully CCW, then slowly turn it CW until you feel it make contact. From there it's a matter of test driving and small adjustments to get it back where it should be.

Replacement gears for some of these boxes, particularly the oldest are becoming difficult to find, thus rebuilders too often take shortcuts. Instead of tossing a worn out gearset, they tighten the bejesus out of the box and gamble on the purchaser just living with it. Or attempt to build up the gear faces and grind them back to spec, with generally bad results.
If there are no threads left exposed on the adjustment screw, don't buy that box. You know what the 'rebuilder' did with it.

Pretty much everything you ever wanted to know about the Saginaw boxes and steering columns from one of the guys who designed them:
http://jimshea.corvettefaq.com/

GOTWAX

Ok well I've eliminAted that is the box, any other ideas?

Radi

Not much left other than the pump. Hoses are good, not flaking and blocking internally?
It works fine with the wheels in the air so I doubt the linkages and such are binding. Rebuilt pumps have a certain failure rate too, hopefully it's still under warranty.

GOTWAX

Hoses were replaced when pump was, ya I'm thinking the is out, its under warranty

GOTWAX

The pump*