Shamrock96

Hello all,
So here is the back story, 4 moths ago engine crapped out on me, got a reman, put it all together, replaced more parts than my wallet would like to confess to, and have since put the new engine back in and have had to seal my gas tank and put in a new fuel filter.

NOW: So today the fuel tank sealer was cured and ready to go. my buddy came over to help me start it up for the first time. We put the gas tank in, hooked everything up, almost filled the tank in preparation for the break in, now we am ready to go. The battery is weak so we jumped it off my WJ. Voltage looks good so i turned the key to prim it and it primed strong. Turned the key and it starts to crank and crank and crank then makes a sound like pressure relieving. when i put my hand to the intake i can feel air coming back so after much thinking and a failed attempt to solve the issue with a "shortcut" (tried swapping the ignition wires around and that was a bad idea the engine would start but come to a shuddering stall seconds after it started)and a phone call or 2 we determine that my initial timing is off 180 degrees. So we rotate the engine to TDC on the compression stroke and reset the distributor. Try again and it is close but not perfect. So we adjust the distributor again and the rotor is dead center on the pin for cylinder one. So we try again it starts cranking and i push the pedal down for wide open throttle and it sounds like its going to start and it gets so very close and then falls off and starts just cranking again. It keeps coming so very close to turning over but doesn't and i am not sure where to go from here. All wires are properly connected and i know we have fuel pressure and spark. My best guess is that my timing is still off by the smallest bit but other than that i have no idea what it could be. Please all suggestions and ideas are welcome. If you need some more info just ask and i will tell.

partsguyct

How sure are you that your getting a solid strong spark? Also just for kicks check your map sensor

macgyver35

The standard approach is to verify consistent spark (not necessarily correct timing at this point), fuel pressure and regular firing of injectors, properly seated connectors on all sensors, and check vacuum. On a newly remanufactured engine, checking compression is likely not necessary, but certainly won't hurt. Also, double check all of your grounds. BTW, where'd you get the engine?

If all of that is good, the next step is usually to double check initial timing in regard to the initial stab of the dizzy. If that's good, you'd look at crankshaft position sensor. It may not be bad; it might have just gotten knocked around during the swap. The gap it has between itself and the flywheel is pretty important, plus, they are well-known high failure items. Also, the camshaft position sensor should be checked. Other items like the idle air controller may have gotten sticky, or TPS may have developed some corroded contact points from sitting for awhile without moving. It's basically a potentiometer.

I know you say you've got fuel and spark, and double-checked the stab, so work down the rest of the list. You say you think you might still be slightly off on the timing. If you're off even one tooth, your going to be off about 10-15 degrees, which would be pretty noticeable. So assuming you aren't 180 off and you can confirm that you are pointing right at #1 on the cap at TDC, you should be good there as the computer will take care of any slight adjustments.

Also, if yours sat that long, you may have some moisture that built up in the fuel system. Yank your plugs and see if they look wet. While they're out, disconnect the coil and crank the engine for awhile to blow any moisture out. Then replace the plugs and try again. Also, make sure you're using properly gapped Champion (or Autolite in a pinch) plugs, not any of those fancy platinum or iridium or yank-my-chanium plugs.

Shamrock96

I cleared the fuel system a few days ago to make sure all the old gas and anything else was out. I got the long block from FActory Engine Exchange for a good price only real issue i had was that there was no tap in the sensor boss for the temp sender so i had to relocate it to the thermostat housing, any way yes I figured that one more tooth over in the distributor would be too much. as for the plugs.......i will be getting a set of champion plugs if all else fails.....will not say what kind i have now to avoid the fall out from that info..........i considered the idle air motor but ruled that out because it should turn over with the throttle wide open. I will check my crank position sensor tomorrow see if it need some gentile persuasion. Can i use a multimeter to test it to see if it is bad? i kept everything in a proper environment while i was tearing down the old engine and building the new one in an effort to avoid any unwanted environmental contamination.

Shamrock96

is there a proper way to test the map sensor?

Cherockee

I'm going to look for the threads where I posted some pictures about how to install the distributor. It's actually quite easy and fool proof method.

Take the cap off the dizzy, pull the rotor and cam sensor off. You should see a white disk attached to the center shaft that has a half round metal piece attached to it. Near one end of that metal piece is a hole through the white disk. Insert a 3/16" pin or punch through that hole and into the hole in the distributor body. This will hold the shaft in the correct position while you insert the dizzy into the block. Since there is a good chance the cam is not a factory Chrysler part it is most likely that the drive gear is not indexed properly, so when you put the distributor in, (with the engine set to TDC compression stroke of #1 cylinder) the mounting hole may not line up. Technically, with the pin holding the shaft in the correct position, you can install the distributor where ever you want just so long as you follow the correct firing order and know the rotor will be pointed just past the #1 cylinder plug wire. Once the distributor is back in, REMOVE THE PIN. Reinstall the cam sensor and rotor. Note the position of the rotor and mark it on the outside of the distributor. Install the cap and wires, #1 plug wire will be slightly counter-clockwise of your mark. This will be the first thing you check before you check all that other stuff.

Cherockee

Cherockee

With 3/16" punch installed:

Cherockee

This is how far off my distributor was from the mounting hole. It was my choice to ground off the foot plate to the distributor and mount it in this location, but technically you could place it a couple more teeth around (as long as the pin stay installed while you do) and leave the tab alone.

Shamrock96

Ok so I replaced my plugs with plain old auto lite copper plugs and got rid of my ...*cough cough* plugs and tried again but still no go so I put the engine at TDC pulled the rotor and what do you know my dizzy gear is not properly indexed at all



The faint black mark on the dizzy body is TDC and the rotor is right on it now the cam sensor



Appears to be off a good 10 degrees based on pic you posted. So by your method you rotate the body of the dizzy to relocate the sensor so that it is in proper alignment rather than indexing the gear itself which I am assign might be the best way to go for me. I'll give it a shot worst thing is I need a new dizzy.

Shamrock96

Hang on according to your pic I had my timing wrong to begin with today. The pics I saw before on the sight I got my timing info on showed TDC on the dizzy to be in a different spot so let me try something and get back in 5 minuets.

Cherockee

Just put a pin in that hole- its impossible to get it wrong then.

Shamrock96

SUCCESS IT RUNS........ Like crap..... I know it needs time to get the idle right but it's shaking the whole jeep as its running smooth is probably the last word I would use to describe the way it ran. Is this normal I am also getting some pops and puffs out of my exhaust which I assume is backfire

Shamrock96

Could the back fire be caused by all the unburied gas that was exhausted trying to start the engine

Cherockee

First I would ask, did you put a drift pin or 3/16" punch through the hole and into the distributor body while you inserted it into the block? Next, if you did that correctly, would be to check the firing order, make sure all the wires are in the right place. Then take a short video of it running so we can hear it for ourselves.