You got that right.

Nobody should be designing planes, cars, computers, or anything else until they've wrenched on them a while. It's amazing what a few skinned knuckles will do for a young head full of book learning.

 

I think abs is great! The stopping distances are shorter..

 

The good is that the driver has full control over the brakes.
The bad is that the driver has full control over the brakes.

Having driven on winter roads for decades before ABS came along, I'm uncomfortable having electronics make braking decisions for me. Out it goes.

 

They did - as I recall, it was a variation on the "park pawl" found in automatic transmissions (essentially, it was a lever that locked up the mainshaft until the clutch engaged and the vehicle was allowed to go forward, or something like that. Perhaps a selectable centrifugal clutch? I'd have to dig...)

Why you'd need it on an automatic, I've no idea.

TRIVIA - What was the last automatic transmission that could actually be push-started (like a manual,) and why was this possible?

 

Some GM Powerglides, they had a second oil pump on the output shaft

 

I push started (actually pull started) a 61 Buick with 401 nailhead and auto. Had to get it going scary fast to do it.

 

A skilled driver can stop in a shorter distance than ABS.

Few are that skilled, hence the popularity of ABS.

 

Very true, especially the part about few are that skilled. I'll take my ABS any day of the week. Especially when I have all three kids with me. I grew up and learned to drive on non ABS cars. If you take the time to educate yourself about ABS it can be a very useful and useable tool.

 

Yup.
The hidden little ABS secrets are that it can actually lengthen stopping distances on gravel or unpacked snow (which the NHTSA admits), and doesn't always help an unskilled driver avoid accidents if they don't understand that the 'limits of traction' problem also applies to steering.
It does give unskilled drivers their steering ability back, which they promptly misuse, causing the front wheels to lose traction. They "stomp and steer", right into a steering-wheel induced skid.

 

And, mandating all this crap (ABS, Speed-Proportional steering, ESP/"Roll Control," TPMS, &c &c) means that new drivers are going to be trained on this stuff, and they're not going to know how to handle the older vehicles that aren't saddled with all this stuff.

And older driver, trained without this stuff, can drive anything. A new driver? Not so much - they're destined to screw it up...

We're not helping drivers with this stuff, we're handicapping them. The #1 safety device you could possibly have is that mushy kilo of grey stuff between your ears - if you don't learn how to use it, nothing else can help you.

 

All the shortest braking vehicles have abs. Look up the results.

 

What this stuff really does is shift the point where the driver loses control, making the accidents that do happen fairly spectacular.
Give a driver an inch more safety and they tend to consume it by driving differently than they would had the 'safety' device not been there. Thus when they DO lose control it's often at higher speed and under worse circumstances.

Why are you likely to see AWD vehicles in the ditch on a snowy day, despite their inherent greater traction?
Because Sally Homemaker didn't notice the road was slippery, the AWD hid that fact from her, just as it's supposed to do. So she drove as though she had traction, consuming the safety advantage AWD offers.
The rear wheel drive guy OTOH noticed he had no traction while backing out the driveway and drove differently.


http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/200...er-risk-by-51/

Yet the vehicles, on paper, should be able to stop better. What gives?
The ABS increased the threshold for loss of control and unskilled drivers merely consume that increase by driving right up to the new limit. When they do crash, it's under worse circumstances.

 

The cars with the best braking systems would likely still have the best braking systems without the ABS.
You'd have to do a comparison between the exact same car with ABS and again without for it to be meaningful.
And then, on what sort of road surface? On loose snow, gravel and sand ABS always loses. A locked wheel will build up those loose road materials in front of it like a plow, helping it stop. ABS cannot do that.

 

Well, buy your own admission. It cannot be proven abs cars don't break better...

 

I think ABS breaks fantastically. It's a real ***** to fix for the DIYer