muckfoot

WyoCherokee

You just said it. Cut fenders. adjust out your steering stops or get different rims.
It'l rub everywhere. Just install em, and start trimming everywhere it rubs.

Charley3

I've experimented with this myself, and done it (sort of) with 31 x 9.5 R16 load C (245/75R16) all terrain tires with stock fenders and flares. No trimming and no rubbing (even offroad). All I had to do was slightly adjust the steer stops. It still turns plenty sharp. Though full disclosure, my Currie Anti-Rock front swaybar might increase tire clearance between swaybar and tire side-wall or side-lugs.

I have a Curie anti-rock front sway bar and no rear sway bar. So I get a lot of flex and it still doesn't rub.

After settling 0.5" over 1st 6 months, my XJ has a 1.25" lift front (OME Light Load TJ springs) and 1.75" rear (OME Light Load XJ springs). It's now been 3 years and no further settling has occurred. I added full skid plates, which lowered it around 0.3" (weight) which is partly how it ended up settling to the lift heights I stated. It has stock bump stops. i.e. - no bump stop extension, and clears 31 x 9.5 all terrain tires with small side lugs. It wouldn't work with large side lugs of an MT.

An important part of the secret sauce is to run a narrow enough AT tire with minimal side-lugs on a stock width and BS wheel so the tire can tuck into the stock fender without rubbing.

I used stock Jeep Icon 16 x 7 with 5.25" BS. Any AT with minimal side lugs in size 245/75R16 (31 x 9.6) will work. The trick is that the tire is narrow enough to tuck up into the stock fenders without rubbing the fenders or stock flares. No trimming required for 97+ XJ. I don't know how well this would fit on a 96 or earlier. I did it with a 99 XJ.

Note: Using a 16 x 7 wheel with 5.25 BS keeps the narrow tire lined up right under the fender opening so the tire can tuck into fender when suspension compresses. Aftermarket wheels with less backspacing move the tire out so it's underneath the edge of the fender and directly under flare which makes it more likely the tire will rub the fender or flare when the suspension compresses.

I rented some 245 AT tires to try it for a month. Then I put my 30 tires back on because that's what I'm good for. Also, I'm handicapped with arthritis and it was too hard for me to climb into the Jeep with the taller tires. So I'm back to running 30s again. I could run 245s anytime I want to, but I'd have to regear and become more physically nimble.

What's really ironic is I have better tire clearance with 245/75R16 ATs than I do with 30x9.5R15 ATs. How's that? The area of least clearance is between my front swaybar links' top joint and the inside edge of the tire during sharp turns. With a 245 Cooper AT3 (has small side-lugs that don't come down the sidewall very far) smooth sidewall is next to the link joint and there's ample clearance. With a 30 Cooper AT3 the tire is a bit shorter, which causes the side-lugs to be next to the link's joint when I turn sharp. So ironically I have better swaybar clearance with 245s and could run less steerstop adjustment with them than the 30s, but I just leave my steerstops adjusted for 30s since that adjustment works/clears both sizes of tires and turns sharp enough.

StuckBuck

Bump stops, Different wheels, and your gunna have to trim. I know its long but read through this tread and it will give you plenty of info:

https://www.cherokeeforum.com/f67/lo...24-12-a-32980/

Charley3

I think similar might be possible with 31 x 10.5 R15 AT tires (with minimal side-lugs) on stock TJ wheels like a Ravine or Canyon (15 x 8 with 5.5 BS). It would NOT work with stock 15 x 7 with 5.25 BS.

Fender trimming might be required and possibly aftermarket flares with larger than stock opening for larger tire. I've seen several brands of aftermarket flares that accommodate that and look good.

Personally I'd like to fits 31 x 10.5 with stock fenders and flares, and only trim-modify if necessary. That way more can be learned from the experience and shared with others forums. That's how we all learn from each other.

Note: Using a 15 x 8 wheel with 5.5 BS keeps the tire under the fender opening. This means tire can (hopefully) tuck into the fender with less chance of rubbing the fender or flare. If it does rub slightly, it will required less trimming to clear.

StuckBuck

No hate I'm just curious. Why did you decide to run a 600 dollar front sway bar on what sounds like a pretty mild build. Why didn't you go with the tried and true sway bar disco's and save around 500 bucks?

unidentifiedbomb

Sometimes people have too much money to know what's a good use with it.....

5-Speed

When I had 31s on mine with 4.25 bs wheels and 1.75" lift, it rubbed everything. Like I ran a twig over and the tires rubbed. Or I turned the wheel past the 3 o'clock position, they rubbed. After trimming, I could turn the wheel from lock to lock but if it flexed, bad rubbing. The rear was a lot better but still rubbed the flare if you flexed. Picture to see how close the tires are with the 1.75" lift. Cant even imagine it sitting any lower. Bushwacker flats were my problem solver.

Charley3

I'm not offended. That's a valid question.

Anti-Rock cost me around $400.

Short answers are: I wanted maximum awesomeness in a low lift. My lift is mild in regard to height, but not performance. It performs great. My XJ is a sleeper. Looks stockish, but isn't. Also, I have arthritis and it's painful for me to fool around with disconnects, especially in cold or wet weather.

Detailed answers are:

When I had an LJ, I learned that putting larger tires on a stock LJ (33 x 11.5) causes rubbing on stock front swaybar when turning (not the LCAs), and the wider than stock tire rubbed the flares hard during suspension compression (I had stock bumpstops and stock everything).

I realized a narrower 33 could tuck up into the fender and flares instead of hitting them. So I changed to 33 x 10.5 R15 BFG AT. Just as I suspected, there was no more rubbing the fenders or flares.

The narrower 33s didn't rub the stock swaybar as much when turning, but still did some. I tried adjusting steerstops a lot, but then it didn't turn sharp enough in parking lots.

So I got a Currie Anti-Rock front swaybar on my LJ to gain significantly more clearance between front swaybar and tires. A friend with a TJ was running 35 x 11.5 Interco with 2.5" lift on the same stock wheels I had. His 35s did not rub his Anti-Rock and he didn't even need to adjust his steer stops. Wow. He told me an Anti-Rock would have more than enough clearance for 33s on my LJ. I followed his advice and he was correct. I had so much more swaybar-tire clearance that I could turn much sharper. Then I rubbed my LCAs a little at full turns (because I had put steerstop adjustment back to stock). I got some JKS round LCAs and that fixed that. No more rubbing LCAs. Then I had more than enough clearance for 33 x 10.5 on a 1" lifted LJ that could TURN SHARP.

Fast forward to my 99 XJ (my second XJ). As soon as I got it, my first mod was to remove rear swaybar. My 2nd mod was OME 1.25 to 1.5 lift springs. My 3rd mod was Currie Anti-Rock front swaybar.

Currie says XJ needs at least 2" lift to use an Anti-Rock, but I shortened AR swaybar links so I can use AR with 1.25" lift. (front 1.25, rear 1.75). I don't think you can use an Anti-Rock with no lift because the links are to long and can't be shortened enough for no lift. I don't know if it's possible for a stock XJ to clear 245 tires with no lift, no trimming, and stock swaybar. I'm not sure since I didn't run my XJ with stock swaybar long enough to compare stock swaybar's tire clearance to Anti-Rock's tire clearance. The AR swaybar might be an important part of my clearance and it requires at least 1.25" lift to use it.

So that might mean the minimum setup to clear 245s with no trimming includes at least 1.25" lift, Anti-Rock swaybar, 245s with modest side-lugs, 16 x 7 with 5.25 BS (Icons for example).

I'm not sure if fitting 245s is possible with no lift, stock swaybar, and no trimming; but it might be possible. Try it. If it fits then congrats. If it doesn't quite fit, then lift at least 1.25" and install an Anti-Rock (with links shortened enough to work with 1.25" lift), or leave everything stock and do a little trimming. If you don't want to shorten AR links, then lift it at least 1.75" because the AR links work out of the box for 1.75" to 5" lift.

I can't say for sure that the AR increased tire clearance on my XJ, but I assume it did since it did with the LJ. Another reason I think AR increased my XJ's tire clearance is I successfully run the shortest lift I ever heard of that fits 245/75R16 with stock(ish) bumpstops and no trimming.

I have good swaybar to tire clearance, which allows me to run 31 x 9.5 tires on stock wheels with stock width and BS. Icon 16 x 7 with 5.25 BS. That lines up the narrow tires directly under the fenders, which allows the tires to tuck into the fenders without rubbing fenders or flares (with stock(ish) bumpstops and no trimming) when suspension compresses.

Aftermarket wheels with less BS don't work well with low lifts because they put the tire directly under the stock flare and edge of fender, which guarantees massive rubbing when suspension compresses (with stock bumpstops).

The key factors to fitting a 31 with low lift (or possibly no lift) are narrow 9.6" wide (or less) tire with modest side-lugs, stock width and BS wheel (16 x 7 with 5.25 BS, Icon for example), and possibly my AR swaybar might be increasing clearance between swaybar and side of tire, thus allowing the use of a stock 16 x 7 tire.

Other reasons I love the Anti-Rock swaybar:

Anti-Rock allows me to custom tune my swaybar for on or off road, or both. It has 5 adjustments for tuning it's firmness. It ranges from stiffer than stock to very soft. I chose a medium setting that's slightly softer than medium. This works well on and off road for me with my Bilstein 5100 shocks.

Anti-Rock means I don't have to get out of my XJ to disco or reconnect. I commute from city where I live to rural mountains where my cousin lives. I live in Washington. He lives in Oregon in mountains. The drives starts out on paved highway, but then changes to gravel roads with washboard, and the last mile is legit offroading to get to his cabin. I like being able to make that commute and back again in any weather without having to get out to disconnect swaybar and reconnect later. It's usually raining and cold. Sometimes snowy and cold. The last thing I want to do is get out to fool around with swaybar disconnects.

Anti-Rock, Bilstein 5100 shocks for 3" lift (their specs say they can compress short enough to work with stock bumpstops, but full disclosure, I did increase my bumpstop 1/4" to protect the shocks), and my Old Man Emu springs combine to give me great handling and comfort, as well as great articulation offroad. I had more flex than the stock brake lines could handle (they had become limiting straps, yikes). So I had to install longer brakes lines that are spec'd for a 3" lift. That allows even more flex and no strain on brake lines.

Another little trick I did was use 1/2" thick soft durometer rubber for my bumpstop extension in the front. Rubber hocky pucks basically. During articulation they are a 1/2" bumpstop extension, but under impact when hitting a bump they compress around 1/4".

So the rubber hockey pucks soften impact by giving bumpstop a soft landing when I hit a huge bump, and they provide 1/4" bumpstop extension to protect the shocks from hard bumps (though Bilstein specs would have me believe the stock bumpstops would be fine). The rubbe hockey pucks also provide 1/2" bumpstop extension when articulating. I doubt that matters much for tire clearance when articulating, but it might help some. Everything fits and clears great with 245 ATs on and off road.

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Edited in Later: I suggest the OP uses the stock swaybar since he has no lift. If he lifts 1.25" or higher then he would have the option of using an Anti-Rock front swaybar. However, even if he lifts, I suggest staying with stock swaybar and trying that first. AR is a viable options with at least 1.25" lift, but it shouldn't be a first resort.

Charley3

Bushwacker flares was your problem-solver. I can see that.

I think your problem-causer was wheels with 4.25" BS moved the tires out under the stock flares. They hit the flares instead of tucking into fenders. Also, what width 31s do you have?

This is why I used 16 x 7 with 5.25 BS to keep narrow 245s under my stock fenders (NOT under the flares).

Charley3

P.S. - since OP wants LCOG setup, I'll add one thing that helps that. Skidplates.

The weight of skidplates under a Jeep is so low that it's like ballast in a ship. It lowers COG.

My XJ handles better onroad after installing skidplates, and they have obvious benefits offroad (especially with a low lift or no lift).

My highway gas mileage was not affected by skidplates because although they add weight, they make under-carriage smoother for less wind drag.

My city gas mileage probably went down a little from the 200 lbs weight, but I don't know for sure since I don't test city mpg.

5-Speed

I believe you are right. The offset did not help. 10.5" is the tire width. But even with the flat flares and the tires able to suck in to the fenders, I still had to add in a 2" bump stop. It doesnt hit the flare, it hits the pinch seam.

Charley3

If you go the 245/75R15 (31 x 9.6 R16) AT route, that is the best/easiest way to mount a 31 with very low lift, or possibly no lift, and little or no trimming. In my case 1.25" lift and no trimming.

A key part of success (without trimming, retaining maximum turning radius) is choosing a narrow 245 AT with modest side-lugs.

I suggest a load C Tire because LT tires have deeper tread and are tougher than passenger tires. I do not like a load E tires on an XJ because E rated tires are heavy and stiff.

Good 245/75R16 load C candidates that I know of are: Cooper AT3 and ATW, Hercules AT2, Wild Country XTX Sport, Mastercraft AXT, Toyo AT2, and possibly others.

There are many more 245 ATs in P (passenger) rated to choose from. Silent Armor is a good example. It would be easy to fit. However P rated don't have quite as deep a tread as C rated.

If you want to use 31 x 10.5 R15 you're going to need to do trimming or lift, or a combination. An example of a combination is 1" to 2" lift and a little trimming. The easiest 31 x 10.5 tires to fit are the tire brands-models I listed above due to their modest side-lugs.

There may be additional good tires for LCOG fitment that I don't know of. Look for modest-small side-lugs and load C rating.

Whatever small amount of off-road performance you miss from having small side-lugs, you will more than regain from being able to fit a larger tire with less lift (and/or less trimming).

StuckBuck

Got any pics of your rig? Now I'm interested!

Charley3

I'll post some pics of my XJ within the next day or two.