Thoughts?
Thread Starter
Member
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 105
Likes: 0
From: Richmond TX
Year: 2001
Model: Cherokee
Saw this and decided to shut down for the night before it got too involved
..i know it's the reason for the miss fire codes, bit what caused only 3 outa 6 to get that much build up? First 3 were burnt amd last 3 were good? ?First burnt one starts at the front and works backwards towards cabin
..i know it's the reason for the miss fire codes, bit what caused only 3 outa 6 to get that much build up? First 3 were burnt amd last 3 were good? ?First burnt one starts at the front and works backwards towards cabin
Member
Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 174
Likes: 0
From: The Colony, TX
Year: 2001
Model: Cherokee
Engine: 4.0
My first thoughts are leaking valve guides or worn rings allowing oil to get by in those cylinders. I would start with a compression test and a leak down test. Post the results when you are done. Hopefully I'm wrong and one of the 4.0 experts will chime in soon with more suggestions.
Last edited by FTHESHACK; Apr 18, 2014 at 06:56 PM.
CF Veteran




Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 5,840
Likes: 117
From: In the middle of Minnesota!
Year: 1999
Model: Cherokee
Engine: 4.0
Yup, compression test is the place to start.
The spec. for the 4.0 is 120-150, with no more than a 30 psi variation between cylinders.
Perform a dry test, then a wet test on any cylinders that show out of spec compression.
Post the results here for comment.
The spec. for the 4.0 is 120-150, with no more than a 30 psi variation between cylinders.
Perform a dry test, then a wet test on any cylinders that show out of spec compression.
Post the results here for comment.
Thread Starter
Member
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 105
Likes: 0
From: Richmond TX
Year: 2001
Model: Cherokee
Dry, just hook up gauge and turn over, see what you got.
Wet, pour tiny amount of oil into spark plug hole (cylinder)and hook up gauge and turn over again..see what the difference is..am i right guys?
Wet, pour tiny amount of oil into spark plug hole (cylinder)and hook up gauge and turn over again..see what the difference is..am i right guys?
+1. If the compression reading comes up substantially after adding a bit of oil to the cylinder, the rings are suspect. The oil helps the rings seal temporarily.
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Those readings look fine.
What mfgr/part# are those plugs? Single platinums by chance? How many miles on them?
Your waste spark ignition fires plugs as pairs: 1&6, 3&4, 2&5, single plats wear three plugs faster than the other three because half of them fire reverse polarity. Just tossing it out there.
I'd screw in fresh set of NGK and see what happens. Make sure the coils are seated right, making good contact, no cracks or arc marks where they contact the plugs..
What mfgr/part# are those plugs? Single platinums by chance? How many miles on them?
Your waste spark ignition fires plugs as pairs: 1&6, 3&4, 2&5, single plats wear three plugs faster than the other three because half of them fire reverse polarity. Just tossing it out there.
I'd screw in fresh set of NGK and see what happens. Make sure the coils are seated right, making good contact, no cracks or arc marks where they contact the plugs..
CF Veteran
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 8,357
Likes: 103
From: Canton, MI
Year: 1999
Model: Cherokee
Engine: 4.0
Saw this and decided to shut down for the night before it got too involved
..i know it's the reason for the miss fire codes, bit what caused only 3 outa 6 to get that much build up? First 3 were burnt amd last 3 were good? ?First burnt one starts at the front and works backwards towards cabin
Attachment 239313
..i know it's the reason for the miss fire codes, bit what caused only 3 outa 6 to get that much build up? First 3 were burnt amd last 3 were good? ?First burnt one starts at the front and works backwards towards cabinAttachment 239313
Can't see the plugs too well because the pic is so small, but are the plugs "burnt" or are they sooty fouled?
If they're sooty/fouled....
With a split exhaust (Catalytic Converters and O2S's) you may be getting a lean signal to the PCM on that bank cylinders and the PCM is adjusting the injector pulse width to the rich side to compensate, thus fouling out the plugs.
Thread Starter
Member
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 105
Likes: 0
From: Richmond TX
Year: 2001
Model: Cherokee
Those readings look fine.
What mfgr/part# are those plugs? Single platinums by chance? How many miles on them?
Your waste spark ignition fires plugs as pairs: 1&6, 3&4, 2&5, single plats wear three plugs faster than the other three because half of them fire reverse polarity. Just tossing it out there.
I'd screw in fresh set of NGK and see what happens. Make sure the coils are seated right, making good contact, no cracks or arc marks where they contact the plugs..
What mfgr/part# are those plugs? Single platinums by chance? How many miles on them?
Your waste spark ignition fires plugs as pairs: 1&6, 3&4, 2&5, single plats wear three plugs faster than the other three because half of them fire reverse polarity. Just tossing it out there.
I'd screw in fresh set of NGK and see what happens. Make sure the coils are seated right, making good contact, no cracks or arc marks where they contact the plugs..
Thread Starter
Member
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 105
Likes: 0
From: Richmond TX
Year: 2001
Model: Cherokee
What codes did you get? Can you post the exact code(s) here?
Can't see the plugs too well because the pic is so small, but are the plugs "burnt" or are they sooty fouled?
If they're sooty/fouled....
With a split exhaust (Catalytic Converters and O2S's) you may be getting a lean signal to the PCM on that bank cylinders and the PCM is adjusting the injector pulse width to the rich side to compensate, thus fouling out the plugs.
Very first i was getting P1494, found dry rotted hoses and got that one cleared..drove it around the block a few times and got P0171, cleared it and drove around the block again, thats when i got p0300,p0301,p0302,p0171..cleared and did further troubleshooting, thats when i pulled the plugs and made this post..yesterday did compression test and installed new plugs..everything is running smoother for the most part. Not perfect like I'd like..p0171 came back (no cel though if that means anything) and that's when i did more searching and found a few post you made about the IAC and O2 sensors..pull 1-3 up stream sensor and its got a little bit of caked on carbon

I know you've had some problems with my picture(been posting from phone) but the picture is of just the head of the sensor..i know its first in line in the exhaust but isn't this even a little too dirty for a sensor? And i will pull the IAC when i get some MAF cleaner amd a box of q-tips later on today
CF Veteran
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 8,357
Likes: 103
From: Canton, MI
Year: 1999
Model: Cherokee
Engine: 4.0
P0171-1/1 FUEL SYSTEM LEAN
When Monitored: With the engine running in closed loop mode, the ambient/battery
temperature above 20 deg. F and altitude below 8000 ft.
Set Condition: If the PCM multiplies short term compensation by long term adaptive and a certain percentage is exceeded for two trips, a freeze frame is stored, the MIL illuminates and a trouble code is stored.
Possible Causes:
INTERMITTENT CONDITION
RESTRICTED FUEL SUPPLY LINE
FUEL PUMP INLET STRAINER PLUGGED
FUEL PUMP MODULE
O2 SENSOR
O2 SENSOR SIGNAL CIRCUIT SHORTED TO GROUND
O2 SENSOR HEATER OPERATION
TPS VOLTAGE GREATER THAN 0.92 VOLTS WITH THROTTLE CLOSED
TP SENSOR SWEEP
MAP SENSOR OPERATION
ECT SENSOR OPERATION
ENGINE MECHANICAL PROBLEM
FUEL FILTER/PRESSURE REGULATOR (HIGH)
PCM
Most of these possible causes are for a lean condition across the board but yours is limited to 1/1 so I would go ahead and replace that 1/1 O2S and see what happens.
You can see on that sooty O2S that the PCM is dumping fuel in 1-3 to compensate for a lean signal.
Here's a pic of your exhaust with the NTK O2S part numbers.
Edit: Do not mix Bosch O2S with NTK O2S.
When Monitored: With the engine running in closed loop mode, the ambient/battery
temperature above 20 deg. F and altitude below 8000 ft.
Set Condition: If the PCM multiplies short term compensation by long term adaptive and a certain percentage is exceeded for two trips, a freeze frame is stored, the MIL illuminates and a trouble code is stored.
Possible Causes:
INTERMITTENT CONDITION
RESTRICTED FUEL SUPPLY LINE
FUEL PUMP INLET STRAINER PLUGGED
FUEL PUMP MODULE
O2 SENSOR
O2 SENSOR SIGNAL CIRCUIT SHORTED TO GROUND
O2 SENSOR HEATER OPERATION
TPS VOLTAGE GREATER THAN 0.92 VOLTS WITH THROTTLE CLOSED
TP SENSOR SWEEP
MAP SENSOR OPERATION
ECT SENSOR OPERATION
ENGINE MECHANICAL PROBLEM
FUEL FILTER/PRESSURE REGULATOR (HIGH)
PCM
Most of these possible causes are for a lean condition across the board but yours is limited to 1/1 so I would go ahead and replace that 1/1 O2S and see what happens.
You can see on that sooty O2S that the PCM is dumping fuel in 1-3 to compensate for a lean signal.
Here's a pic of your exhaust with the NTK O2S part numbers.
Edit: Do not mix Bosch O2S with NTK O2S.
Last edited by CCKen; Apr 20, 2014 at 11:16 AM.
CF Veteran
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 12,367
Likes: 23
From: Oroville, CA
Year: 1995
Model: Grand Cherokee
Engine: 4.0 with all of the noise and clatter
Damn Ken, you're a smart guy! You are the guru of post RENIX XJs. Between what you and Cruiser provide there is no reason why members should have a crappy running Jeep.


