Steering/Suspension Help
Thread Starter
Member
Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 242
Likes: 17
From: Indiana
Year: 1998
Model: Cherokee (XJ)
Engine: 4.0 Inline 6
I'm ordering inner and outer tie rods, as well as one that connects the pitman arm to the drag link. Costs about $20 for parts.
Also, I know certain parts need to be greased. Do these typically come with grease in them or do I need to find a tool to pump grease?
Also, I know certain parts need to be greased. Do these typically come with grease in them or do I need to find a tool to pump grease?
CF Veteran
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 3,700
Likes: 238
From: Groton, MA
Year: 1995
Model: Cherokee(XJ)
Engine: I6 4.0L
Sorry, couldn't resist!
Yeah, it's nice to have solid steering stuff. I got Death Wobble one time on the highway and that was it - I just replaced everything and now it's tight and solid at high speeds and over bumps.
CF Veteran
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 3,700
Likes: 238
From: Groton, MA
Year: 1995
Model: Cherokee(XJ)
Engine: I6 4.0L
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There will be a little grease in the joint, but you'll definitely want to grease the parts after they're installed.You can get a simple grease gun from a parts store or Walmart that pops on the zerk (the little grease fitting) and then you just pump a few pumps of grease in. You will only want like 3 pumps or so, too much grease can be a bad thing.When you go to do the replacement, make sure you measure the old setup since that long tube from the driver's side to the drag link controls toe-in alignment. Some people count the threads.On the drag link to pitman arm, the sleeve thing controls the steering wheel center.Keep in mind some of the parts (like the tie rod that connects the tube to drag link) are LEFT hand threads (so lefty tighty, righty loosey )Another helpful thing is to have a MAP torch and bench vise that has a pipe holder. The old parts can be difficult to get apart (especially if you have lots of rust - which you do) and heating up the parts and taking them apart on the bench is a lot easier than without.I use a healthy amount of anti-seize on the threads into the adjustment tube. The alignment folks basically turn the adjustment tube or sleeve to set the alignment, so the easier it is to turn, the better. The clamps keep it in place once it's set. If you use anti-seize on the stud (where the nuts go on) keep in mind antiseize modifys the torque, so you usually go a little lower on the torque value. You do want the castle nuts well onto the studs so the stud is tight in the hole. Those holes are tapered and if the stud is loose it can wallow out the hole and cause problems. The new tie rods will be tight enough to torque the nuts without spinning, so only use the impact to remove unless you absolutely have to.When I did mine I took great care to match the measurements and still ended up with my steering wheel off center. You will want an alignment afterwards.
)Another helpful thing is to have a MAP torch and bench vise that has a pipe holder. The old parts can be difficult to get apart (especially if you have lots of rust - which you do) and heating up the parts and taking them apart on the bench is a lot easier than without.I use a healthy amount of anti-seize on the threads into the adjustment tube. The alignment folks basically turn the adjustment tube or sleeve to set the alignment, so the easier it is to turn, the better. The clamps keep it in place once it's set. If you use anti-seize on the stud (where the nuts go on) keep in mind antiseize modifys the torque, so you usually go a little lower on the torque value. You do want the castle nuts well onto the studs so the stud is tight in the hole. Those holes are tapered and if the stud is loose it can wallow out the hole and cause problems. The new tie rods will be tight enough to torque the nuts without spinning, so only use the impact to remove unless you absolutely have to.When I did mine I took great care to match the measurements and still ended up with my steering wheel off center. You will want an alignment afterwards.
Thread Starter
Member
Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 242
Likes: 17
From: Indiana
Year: 1998
Model: Cherokee (XJ)
Engine: 4.0 Inline 6
10-4 good buddy. I found a mini grease gun that comes with some cartridges on Rock Auto. The Jeep needs an alignment anyway, so that'll be two birds with one stone. I'll update you guys when that parts come and I need help or when I'm done with the project.
CF Veteran
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 3,700
Likes: 238
From: Groton, MA
Year: 1995
Model: Cherokee(XJ)
Engine: I6 4.0L
Sounds good - we're here for advice if things get tricky. Tie rods are relatively easy and are noticable thing, so it's a good "early" project when you're starting out.
Once you have the grease gun, go ahead and hit the upper ball joint, any of the tie rods you don't change, the slip joint on the front driveshaft, etc with a couple pumps of fresh grease.
You may or may not have greaseable joints on the driveshafts, but you'll have to (want to) remove the shafts to get the nozzle on them. If you're feeling ambitious, go ahead and do those too if you want.
Once you have the grease gun, go ahead and hit the upper ball joint, any of the tie rods you don't change, the slip joint on the front driveshaft, etc with a couple pumps of fresh grease.
You may or may not have greaseable joints on the driveshafts, but you'll have to (want to) remove the shafts to get the nozzle on them. If you're feeling ambitious, go ahead and do those too if you want.
Junior Member
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 67
Likes: 1
From: Chicago, IL
Year: 2001
Model: Cherokee (XJ)
Engine: 4.0L
What's up guys..
Been dealing with the same issues. Pretty much fed up. She's a well cared for 01 Cherokee Sport with 115,000 with very minimal underbody rust. Always garaged and washed. Bought her roughly 13 years ago with 30,000 miles, yep, love her. Mainly city driving, rarely see much highway. However, now noticing highway driving is quite a struggle. She seems to have quite a bit of play in the steering wheel, tends to wander on the highway and more than not (depending on the road surface) wants to pull to the right. Always tends to veer right when hitting a bumps too..
Anyhow... I recently installed a new set of Deegan 38 Mickey Thompson's, front and rear Crown HD springs and a set of 4 red 2018 JK shocks. All in all, a very impressive change in ride. Now on to tackling the front end steering trouble. So, I'm thinking it must be time to rebuild the front end linkage and/or steering box.
Decided to stop by a local repair shop, they gave her an inspection, (how thorough, no idea, but showed me play in the linkages with the front end raised up) then quoted me $950 in labor ALONE to replace...
1) Upper and lower ball joints
2) Inner and outer tie rods
3) Track bar
4) Adjusters (whatever those are)
Could this really be anywhere near a 9 hour job??? Any help on what quality parts would cost, would be a very helpful..
Thanks guys,
Raz
Been dealing with the same issues. Pretty much fed up. She's a well cared for 01 Cherokee Sport with 115,000 with very minimal underbody rust. Always garaged and washed. Bought her roughly 13 years ago with 30,000 miles, yep, love her. Mainly city driving, rarely see much highway. However, now noticing highway driving is quite a struggle. She seems to have quite a bit of play in the steering wheel, tends to wander on the highway and more than not (depending on the road surface) wants to pull to the right. Always tends to veer right when hitting a bumps too..
Anyhow... I recently installed a new set of Deegan 38 Mickey Thompson's, front and rear Crown HD springs and a set of 4 red 2018 JK shocks. All in all, a very impressive change in ride. Now on to tackling the front end steering trouble. So, I'm thinking it must be time to rebuild the front end linkage and/or steering box.
Decided to stop by a local repair shop, they gave her an inspection, (how thorough, no idea, but showed me play in the linkages with the front end raised up) then quoted me $950 in labor ALONE to replace...
1) Upper and lower ball joints
2) Inner and outer tie rods
3) Track bar
4) Adjusters (whatever those are)
Could this really be anywhere near a 9 hour job??? Any help on what quality parts would cost, would be a very helpful..
Thanks guys,
Raz
CF Veteran
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 3,700
Likes: 238
From: Groton, MA
Year: 1995
Model: Cherokee(XJ)
Engine: I6 4.0L
9 hours if you do it yourself and have trouble getting the knuckles off maybe.
A professional mechanic with the proper tools and a lift should be able to knock out new ball joints and tie rod stuff in a couple hours. 4 max.
Adjusters I'm assuming mean the sleeve on the drag link to pitman arm and the long tube from the drag link to drivers tire. These are just threaded metal tubes, you would only replace them if they're damaged or possibly to make the job easier..
A professional mechanic with the proper tools and a lift should be able to knock out new ball joints and tie rod stuff in a couple hours. 4 max.
Adjusters I'm assuming mean the sleeve on the drag link to pitman arm and the long tube from the drag link to drivers tire. These are just threaded metal tubes, you would only replace them if they're damaged or possibly to make the job easier..
Junior Member
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 67
Likes: 1
From: Chicago, IL
Year: 2001
Model: Cherokee (XJ)
Engine: 4.0L
Appreciate the quick reply PH.. This was my exact feel, figures. I have a call into the shop requesting more detail on what they're referring to with the adjusters. They made no mention of making any repair to the drag link and/or pitman arm. I'll report back, but these guys seem to be not what I hoped...
Any info on pricing or suggested quality parts replacement would be a great help..
Thanks,
Raz
Any info on pricing or suggested quality parts replacement would be a great help..
Thanks,
Raz
CF Veteran
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 3,700
Likes: 238
From: Groton, MA
Year: 1995
Model: Cherokee(XJ)
Engine: I6 4.0L
Yeah, it's not all that much work - definitely do-able yourself if you've got the basic tools and equipment. A ball joint press is rentable from your local Autozone or other parts retailer for free (just leave deposit until return). The hardest part is the ball joints - taking the axles out, pulling the knuckle off (which requires disconnecting the tie-rods so, it can and should be done at the same time) and pressing the ball joints out and in. A good impact driver is essential for taking tie-rods apart - the [Edit - STUDS ] like to spin [without the nut backing off, of course.]. A pickle fork is quite helpful as well (also rentable from your parts retailer).
I had trouble with the steering knuckle being frozen to my old ball joints,.. it was a pain and required a lot of heat and a BFH to finally separate them. I was on the verge of cutting the old ball joint studs.
You can replace the entire steering system (all the tie rods and the track bar) for about $200 in parts. Ball joints can be had for about $35/e for decent ones.
I used Moog for all the tie-rods when I did my 95. The only thing I didn't replace was the long adjustment tube.
I had trouble with the steering knuckle being frozen to my old ball joints,.. it was a pain and required a lot of heat and a BFH to finally separate them. I was on the verge of cutting the old ball joint studs.
You can replace the entire steering system (all the tie rods and the track bar) for about $200 in parts. Ball joints can be had for about $35/e for decent ones.
I used Moog for all the tie-rods when I did my 95. The only thing I didn't replace was the long adjustment tube.
Junior Member
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 67
Likes: 1
From: Chicago, IL
Year: 2001
Model: Cherokee (XJ)
Engine: 4.0L
PH,
You were right, the suggested adjuster is for the drag link. They didn't make any mention of the long tube you're referring to. So it sounds like the a holes want me to pay to make their job easier and gouge me in hours.. No thanks..She hardly has any rust on the underside either.
If you don't mind aiding my understanding. Can you explain where the inner and outer tie rods are used? How many I need? Where the upper and lower ball joints are used and how many I need? Purchasing a track bar seems self explanatory. Thinking of going Moog for everything as well. Seems to be somewhat higher quality.
Thanks again,
Raz
You were right, the suggested adjuster is for the drag link. They didn't make any mention of the long tube you're referring to. So it sounds like the a holes want me to pay to make their job easier and gouge me in hours.. No thanks..She hardly has any rust on the underside either.
If you don't mind aiding my understanding. Can you explain where the inner and outer tie rods are used? How many I need? Where the upper and lower ball joints are used and how many I need? Purchasing a track bar seems self explanatory. Thinking of going Moog for everything as well. Seems to be somewhat higher quality.
Thanks again,
Raz
CF Veteran
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 3,700
Likes: 238
From: Groton, MA
Year: 1995
Model: Cherokee(XJ)
Engine: I6 4.0L
There's an awesome picture floating around - it may have been posted in this thread.
Ball joints are at the end of the axle in the front. 1 upper and 1 lower per side (so 2 upper, 2 lower needed). The steering knuckle conects to the axle with the ball joints. You have to remove the front axle shafts to get them out.
Stu's off road has an awesome write up on changing them. They use a TJ but it's the same on an XJ.
Tie rods are outer 1 at drivers side connecting the knuckle. Drag link is the passengers side outer. There is an inner tie rod that connects the driver's side (where the long adjustment tube is) to the drag link. Then there is a tie rod at the pitman arm that connects with a sleeve to the drag link.
Rock auto will list the parts by location. So 3 little tie rods and 1 drag link tie rod. There's also the shock thing (steering damper) that connects to the drag link.
Ball joints are at the end of the axle in the front. 1 upper and 1 lower per side (so 2 upper, 2 lower needed). The steering knuckle conects to the axle with the ball joints. You have to remove the front axle shafts to get them out.
Stu's off road has an awesome write up on changing them. They use a TJ but it's the same on an XJ.
Tie rods are outer 1 at drivers side connecting the knuckle. Drag link is the passengers side outer. There is an inner tie rod that connects the driver's side (where the long adjustment tube is) to the drag link. Then there is a tie rod at the pitman arm that connects with a sleeve to the drag link.
Rock auto will list the parts by location. So 3 little tie rods and 1 drag link tie rod. There's also the shock thing (steering damper) that connects to the drag link.
CF Veteran
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 3,700
Likes: 238
From: Groton, MA
Year: 1995
Model: Cherokee(XJ)
Engine: I6 4.0L
Picture is in post #14.
The long adjuster tube is labeled "tie-rod", but it connects the outer left (drivers side) with the inner tie rod and is just a threaded pipe. There are clamps at each end, when adjusting toe-in during an alignment, you loosen the clamps then turn that pipe and it sets the distance between the front of the tires.
The adjuster sleeve on the drag link sets the center of the steering wheel.
When I replaced my steering, I got a new sleeve so I could simply remove the tie rods at the steering knuckles, pitman arm and damper and compare.
I spent a lot of time trying to make sure the new parts were measured to the same as the old, but I still wasn't accurate - my wheel was off center and I ended up just biting the bullet and having an alignment.
The long adjuster tube is labeled "tie-rod", but it connects the outer left (drivers side) with the inner tie rod and is just a threaded pipe. There are clamps at each end, when adjusting toe-in during an alignment, you loosen the clamps then turn that pipe and it sets the distance between the front of the tires.
The adjuster sleeve on the drag link sets the center of the steering wheel.
When I replaced my steering, I got a new sleeve so I could simply remove the tie rods at the steering knuckles, pitman arm and damper and compare.
I spent a lot of time trying to make sure the new parts were measured to the same as the old, but I still wasn't accurate - my wheel was off center and I ended up just biting the bullet and having an alignment.
CF Veteran
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 3,700
Likes: 238
From: Groton, MA
Year: 1995
Model: Cherokee(XJ)
Engine: I6 4.0L
The one caveat with the Moog track bar is it seems to be a bit longer than stock. If you have a stock height Jeep, you might consider another brand - I put a 1.75" lift in the front (to compensate for my new leaf springs that were tilting the back end up) and the Moog seems perfect for that - at stock height it seemed like the axle was off center with the Moog, but I could be crazy.
Junior Member
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 67
Likes: 1
From: Chicago, IL
Year: 2001
Model: Cherokee (XJ)
Engine: 4.0L
PH,
Appreciate it man, very helpful. Had you thought of replacing the axle u-joint given ball link replacement? Any thoughts or suggestions on going with decent parts with grease fittings? Curious if a kit with all replacement parts is available?
Regarding my suspension, I did go with a new set of Crown HD rear leaves and front springs. Sitting about 2" above OEM I believe. Hmmm, now wondering if an adjustable track bar exists?
Thanks,
Raz
Appreciate it man, very helpful. Had you thought of replacing the axle u-joint given ball link replacement? Any thoughts or suggestions on going with decent parts with grease fittings? Curious if a kit with all replacement parts is available?
Regarding my suspension, I did go with a new set of Crown HD rear leaves and front springs. Sitting about 2" above OEM I believe. Hmmm, now wondering if an adjustable track bar exists?
Thanks,
Raz
