BlackXJay

I just did an oil change a few weeks ago. As we all know the filter housing is in the worst possible place. So long story short I saturated the starter plug with oil and had a no start at a gas station. Had no choice but to buy brake cleaner and hit the connections and bang the starter and the car started right up. So I cleaned all connections very well when I got the car home and the car was fine for about 2 weeks. (Also cleaned battery connections, and upgraded every battery cable, positive and negative including battery to starter cable about 3 months ago) So in other words I don't know if banging the starter or cleaning the connection was what helpded. Today had the same problem with a no start. Take the starter out and see a little oil nothing crazy but the starter was spinning a little rough. Ended up buying a new starter and put it in and the car fires right up

So do you guys think it was 100% the starter because I can't suffer another no start in the cold. Also does anyone have a write up on an upgrade for the stupid tiny wire to the starter (the one that goes to the connector), I'm assuming it's from the pdc.

Sorry it's a 1999 4.0. 143k

97grand4.0

Try starting it in Neutral.

BlackXJay

Been doing that for awhile now on and off. Have not got around to re servicing the nss.

BlackXJay

But that was not the problems. Thanks

machinisttx

I had a similar issue with the starter on my '00, except that I took it to a local shop to rebuild. Mine was completely worn out. Having to knock on the starter is a pretty good indication that the brushes are making poor contact/worn out/sticking. Also could be full of oil if your filter adapter is leaking.

Are you talking about the trigger wire for the solenoid? Has a plastic connector on it? There's nothing special about it. The connector that's attached to the starter solenoid is held on with one screw, you can remove it and put it on a new starter. That's what I did...starters for 98 and older cherokees are cheaper than for 99+. As far as I can tell, the only difference is that little plastic connector. Alternatively, you can cut the connector off and install a ring terminal.

You can get the parts to rebuild the starter at http://www.aspwholesale.com/ I have a starter from a '91 that I need to rebuild for a spare.

BlackXJay

Well starter is changed and car seems to be starting well. And yes that is the wire I am talking about.

Does anyone have any info on upgrading that wire???

I hate the fact a tiny flimsy wire can cause a no start in my vehicle. I'd like to use a lower gauge wire and wrap it but from the starter it enters the battery wire loom and I don't know where it goes. Any info on this? Thanks guys

machinisttx

That wire only needs to carry a few milliamps of current to activate the solenoid. Upgrading it would be like peeing your pants in a dark suit: you get a warm feeling, but nobody else notices.

Unless it's somehow damaged, doing anything to it other than connecting it to the solenoid is a waste of time/effort/$$$.

JandDGreens

Honestly I would buy one of his kits and up-grade all you cables. He does a great job for a very reasonable price. I bought the 00 kits so that when I up-grade my alternator the wiring will support the high amps.
https://www.cherokeeforum.com/f73/up...cables-221513/

BlackXJay

I have a Durango 160 amp with all 0 gauge wiring I did myself after grinding down the bracket . Only wire that was not done is the wire that goes to the solenoid connector and I have not seen an upgrade to this wire in any kit I looked in to.

BlackXJay

The positive going to the starter is 0 gauge from the pdc. I'm wondering about the wire that goes to the alternator connector. Thanks for your input

machinisttx

You guys have thrown money away. Your entire circuit length there is less than eight feet. 2 gauge cable is more than enough for ~150 amps at that length. Increasing the cable size above that is again, like peeing your pants in a dark suit. That's even assuming that ~150 amps is actually going to be flowing through it all the time, and it won't be.The alternator is rarely going to produce that much for more than a couple of minutes at a time, and typically only if the battery has failed or there is a heavy electrical load(winching for example). Even if demand is present, after the alternator heats up, the actual output will go down. The rating is just that, a rating...not a guarantee, and the alternator only produces enough amperage to keep voltage at around 13.8V.

As far as the connector wires....assuming the alternator is capable of producing 160 amps, it would take about 12 amps at 13.8v to fully energize the rotor, more at lower voltage----and less for lower output. In other words, if the alternator only has to produce 10 amps to maintain system voltage, it would only need less than an amp through that wire to energize the rotor. The vehicle computer controls alternator output, so you'd have to replace all the wire between that connector and the computer. I don't recall offhand what size those wires are, but 16 gauge would yield about a 10% voltage loss in a 20 foot circuit. 14 gauge would be roughly 3% loss. Lot of work for little gain....and again, there will only rarely be that much current requirement on the circuit anyway. Also, larger wires may not fit the connector terminals.

Uncaged_88

I also had this same problem with my 99 although I have a mystery oil leak that I'm trying to find to fix. The oil leak caused my starter to short out. Short term fix for now to avoid a no start I cut a small piece of tin metal and attached it below the filter housing and haven't had any issues knock on wood. Long term fix is find the oil leak. Hope this helps a little. I can send you pics of the tin metal if needed. Good luck.

machinisttx

The oil filter adapter is probably leaking. You need a T50(IIRC) torx driver to remove the adapter. Buy a new O ring at the parts store and replace it. Fel-pro 70301 is the part number. Be ready to do some grunting though, they're usually on pretty tight.

Uncaged_88

Thanks I'll try that out and hopefully it'll solve my problem.