positive test for crank pos sensor,finally

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Jul 9, 2017 | 09:51 AM
  #16  
Quote:
.....btw this one takes 300 ma! and has no batt, for that reason i guess. need to use the wall wort or make up a 12 v cord for car batt. i use some dropping diodes to be sure it dont go too high....
Not battery powered! Bummer! That woulda been a big plus for working on cars.

What kind of Voltage requirement does that Oscope need?
Should say on the wall wort.
I myself would be leery of jury rigging something up in order to use the car battery for power and instead stick with the wall wort that came with the unit.
IMO, depending on the voltage requirement, using a bunch of series diodes is not the best idea. There are better ideas out there.

Can't make out the control buttons that good from the picture.
What kind of trigger options does it have?

In addition to the buttons, i see a ****.
Does it have a variable threshold trigger option?
Or only automatic?

I also see two BNC connectors one of which you have the probe connected to.
What is the other connector used for?
Dual channel or external triggering?
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Jul 9, 2017 | 10:29 AM
  #17  
manual
http://www.jyetech.com/Products/LcdScope/e082.php

i cant give all answers right now!,,learning..

d load manual here
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Jul 9, 2017 | 10:57 AM
  #18  
30 minute job with swivel socket and long extension. Some times backing away from the bolt makes things much simpler .
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Jul 9, 2017 | 11:32 AM
  #19  
Quote: 30 minute job with swivel socket and long extension. Some times backing away from the bolt makes things much simpler .
when mine goes ill give you $65/hour to change it.
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Jul 9, 2017 | 12:09 PM
  #20  
Quote: when mine goes ill give you $65/hour to change it.
Going rates about 150 or more at dealer. At least 85 at local shops.
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Jul 9, 2017 | 12:25 PM
  #21  
Quote: Going rates about 150 or more at dealer. At least 85 at local shops.

ok 75 for 30 minutes!
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Jul 9, 2017 | 06:49 PM
  #22  
Quote: 30 minute job with swivel socket and long extension. backing Some timesaway from the bolt makes things much simpler .
And sometimes having a shop do it is way way much simpler too.

Easy for you to say freegdr, you must not have a bad back.
You can change my cps too when/if needed!
Got the tools! Price negotiable! Nice creeper! Band aids! Beer! Easy money!
The only thing i'd require is absolutely NO SWEARING or your labor is free!
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Jul 9, 2017 | 06:55 PM
  #23  
mopar, did you get the scope manual?
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Jul 9, 2017 | 07:40 PM
  #24  
Quote: mopar, did you get the scope manual?
Yeah, i overlooked it quickly!

For a $110, that thing is more than adequate to diagnose auto electrical problems.

-Its a single channel, not bad.
-Max input = 50 volts peak with X1 probe. Using a X10 probe should up that considerably.
But even 50 volts is ok for auto use with the supplied probe.
I wouldn't try to measure household AC voltage with it though. lol
-It has all the needed trigger options, auto, normal, single, rising/falling edge, adjustable, etc. you'll ever need.
-Apparently it is also capable of an external trigger the reason for the 2nd BNC connector. But you'd need another probe.
-up to 10 Mhz bandwidth again more than adequate for auto use.
-Sampling rates from 1KSps to 50MSps. For example 1KSps means basically it takes 1000 samples per second. Again more than adequate.
-Apparently it also has data storage and download features a big plus.

It also runs off a 9 volt DC wall wort.
If i were to jury rig this thing to run off the car battery, 14 volts - 9 volts is just enough headroom to use a generic 9 volt 3 terminal regulator.
Simple voltage regulator circuit to design especially as you indicated at a .3 amp draw. Might not even require a heat sink. Need to do the math.
And i would fuse both the input and output to the regulator.

All in all i think you got a winner there.
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Jul 9, 2017 | 08:29 PM
  #25  
ok good, im looking now at just what i need for car work but clearly there is stuff there i have not seen, used on other scopes and ill look at ways to learn some new stuff in time.
btw i try always to use a 10:1 probe just on principal of safety for the input circuits and loading,that would not be a problem in auto use though.
there are others out there that might be better but ill stick with this,for now, im a sucker for gadgets!
today was barn floor cleanup day so i can move around a little better. hot though but i got most done. big improvement.

oh,it can run up to 12 v huh?
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Jul 10, 2017 | 09:22 AM
  #26  
Quote: .......oh,it can run up to 12 v huh?
What do you mean by that?
Measuring 12 volts or powering it off a 12 volt battery?
If you mean measuring 12 volts DC with it, yep that'll work even with a X1 probe.

Do not power that thing with the car battery alone.
Its designed to run on 9 volts DC according to that spec sheet.

You'll need to drop the voltage down from 14 volts down to 9 using a 9 volt voltage regulator....
...not a series of diodes.
Silicon diode clamping voltages can vary by as much as a few tenths of a volt depending on the current, diode specs, the ambient temp and a varying battery voltage source.
Germanium diodes are even worse and are typically used in low current applications.
Multiple dropping diodes in series is not precise voltage regulation nor a great idea IMO...if need be, maybe on Gilligan's island.

Further, diode over current > max. spec typically causes a diode to short possibly even causing a domino effect with the others.
A shorted diode(s) would have the effect or raising the supply voltage causing possible damage to Oscope.

Got you beat with the X10 probe.
For hi frequency or extremely accurate ramp measurements of fast rise time pulses, i always used a X100 low capacitance probe.
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Jul 10, 2017 | 09:55 AM
  #27  
Quote: What do you mean by that?
Measuring 12 volts or powering it off a 12 volt battery?
If you mean measuring 12 volts DC with it, yep that'll work even with a X1 probe.

Do not power that thing with the car battery alone.
Its designed to run on 9 volts DC according to that spec sheet.

You'll need to drop the voltage down from 14 volts down to 9 using a 9 volt voltage regulator....
...not a series of diodes.
Silicon diode clamping voltages can vary by as much as a few tenths of a volt depending on the current, diode specs, the ambient temp and a varying battery voltage source.
Germanium diodes are even worse and are typically used in low current applications.
Multiple dropping diodes in series is not precise voltage regulation nor a great idea IMO...if need be, maybe on Gilligan's island.

Further, diode over current > max. spec typically causes a diode to short possibly even causing a domino effect with the others.
A shorted diode(s) would have the effect or raising the supply voltage causing possible damage to Oscope.

Got you beat with the X10 probe.
For hi frequency or extremely accurate ramp measurements of fast rise time pulses, i always used a X100 low capacitance probe.
the printed manual says 9-12v, avoid going over 13 v so im ok with 5 diode drops on 14v v.i let the car run awhile to get volts stable. the hummer goes to 15 v on startup for a minute!
jeep is at 14 v max as ive seen it.
i never saw a 100:1 probe!

rain here, good day to wash n wax...
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Jul 10, 2017 | 01:51 PM
  #28  
Quote: 30 minute job with swivel socket and long extension. Some times backing away from the bolt makes things much simpler .


Exactly, with the time and money he has already spent I could have bought and replaced the CPS twice. lol Seriously IMHO this is another one of those tasks guys make out to be MUCH worse than it actually is.
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Jul 10, 2017 | 04:52 PM
  #29  
Quote: Exactly, with the time and money he has already spent I could have bought and replaced the CPS twice. lol Seriously IMHO this is another one of those tasks guys make out to be MUCH worse than it actually is.
the concept here is to develope test procedures to prevent shotgun firing of the "parts cannon" only to find the new part didnt fix the problem.
on another nearby thread the guy just changed the cps and will report back later "if" it fixed it. he still dont know . so people can throw parts at it but i still se that one as not ez. not cheep either.
seriously i dont see how you can reach the connector to unhook it, not my hands. i can touch it with one finger but not 2 hands.
how do you do it.

btw the cost involved here is for test equipment to be used in many areas of troubleshooting. the pulses i showed might not have been seen b4. now we know what to look for instead of shooting parts!

boom,,,boom!
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Jul 10, 2017 | 07:28 PM
  #30  
For the DIYer with no scope, the only definitive test for CPS is swapping with a known good part.

We also know that non-Mopar CPS are a gamble. But a Mopar CPS is not really cheap either. I suppose some people have one on hand from a parts vehicle, yard, or a new one standing by as a spare.

Most tests we see here are only for connectivity and magnetic coil condition, but they won't show you the quality or pattern of the signal it is producing. Which considering its function, is the most important part.

Also, I help a few people with their cars. They aren't car people and they don't have spare parts lying around. They also have no spare money, and that is why I help them when I can. I can't ask them to go pick up a not-cheap part because it may or may not solve the problem.

I could see in those cases where someone has a "known good" CPS on hand perhaps just swapping the sensor. But the scope doesn't lie, and it will show you if it is operating within spec or not without ever removing the part from the vehicle.

Some components can be diagnosed with a test lamp. Some with a meter. Some with a scope.

The reason no DIYers had scopes for the longest time is because they were pretty expensive. But they are dropping in prices like crazy over the last 2-3 years, as are many of the accessories that work with them. So it is getting easier to pick one up these days to have in the DIY garage.

It's a good discussion to be having for those that like to work on their own Jeeps, because working on your own Jeep includes diagnosing your own Jeep before laying out cash.
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