moparado

My front pads are down to bare bones.
Need to do a front brake job soon including new pads and rotors.

I also need a little more stopping power with the over sized tires.
Thinking on Raybestos semi-metalics.

Any one use those or any other recommendations?

investinwaffles

I just threw in some Powerstop Z36 "truck and tow" pads which are supposed to be "Carbon Fiber Infused Ceramic".
I wanted something with GOOD cold bite, pretty good hot performance for the long downhill sections through the Colorado rockies, and was quiet and not too "aggressive" for better rotor wear and a bit less dust. Also cheap.

http://www.powerstop.com/product/power-stop-z36/

I know it's not a truck but the pads seemed to fit my requirements. I was originally set on some cheap-ish semi metallics but I figure I would take the risk since they only cost $32 for the front set. I did have some hesitation because their marketing seems "gimmicky", but they are really good quality and the price made them pretty compelling (to me at least)

Working great for 200 miles now. Bedded in just fine, went with Centric ultra premium rotors all around (anti-rust coating) and they weren't even that expensive (check Amazon for prices, about $30 per rotor)
Others have raved about the Black Magic brake pads but they were out of my price range

http://www.blackmagicbrakes.com/

I have run Hawk HP Plus on my Mustang and it is a MUCH more aggressive pad. So much dust though, like ridiculous amounts. And they were noisy when cold and very "grabby" unless they were warmed up.

moparado

investin, thanks for the reply!

Those powerstops look interesting! Just might go with them.
Also thanks for the headsup on the rotors too.

thatXJguy

Personally I always just go simple and do straight up ceramic. They're nice a quiet.

Rogue4x4

Semi-met here.

There are pros and cons here, as with anything. First thing you need to ask yourself, is what kind of ride are you putting it on...if you run a stock daily driver, vs a lifted and gifted daily, with bumpers, armor, large tires, winch, etc...like mine, haha...it makes a difference.

I ran ceramics for a short time. Plain and simple, they sucked for my application. Yes, they lasted a long time, yes, they were quiet, yes, little to no brake dust, but they just didn't have great stopping power for my setup.

Switched to semi-mets, and the difference in stopping power was quite noticeable. Slightly louder than ceramic, but not unbearable, and they are getting decent life so far, and brake dust is negligible, haven't noticed a difference, really.

In short, ceramic will cost more up front, with decent performance and low noise, and won't be as harsh on your brake system. Semi-mets will cost slightly less, but give better performance, at the cost of being a tad louder, and slightly harsher on your brake system.

If you run a stock setup and daily drive it, ceramic is your best choice, as it will last a long time...more bang for your buck. If you desire or need better performance, go semi-mets.

Rogue4x4

BTW, one last thing, do the rear disc conversion, huge difference...

moparado

ron.., thanks for taking the time for that.

Not a DD. These days its basically a fair weather ride. Trying to keep the rust in check.
Its always had panic stop issues and now with the over size tires, its even worse.
I doubt seriously i can lock the tires up. Other than the tires and ~3" lift, its basically stock.

The rear brakes were already changed a couple years ago with OEM shoes. Maybe i'll replace them also when i do the front pads.

Did some research on those Z36 power stops and haven't read any bad reviews yet.
But for a rotor and pad kit, looking at around $150 at Amazon. The rotors that come with this kit are drilled and slotted.
Don't think hi performance rotors are needed on a Jeep. Might be overkill.

The metalics would be definitely be less exspensive with generic rotors. Or just the powerstop pads with generic rotors.

This could be the last brake job i do on my Jeep so i want to get it right.

Decision time!

investinwaffles

I bought the pads off RockAuto, and got my rotors from Ebay and Amazon (wherever had the best deal, fronts from eBay and rears from Amazon)

I think I spent;

$32 for the front pads
$60 for both front rotors

$25 for the rear pads (ZJ Disc conversion on my XJ)
$15 for parking brake shoes
$60 for the rear rotors

http://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo....315943&jsn=457


As far as ceramic vs semi metallic - I agree that in general - semi metallic is going to grab harder. Stock replacement ceramics are not designed for performance, but performance "biased" ceramic pads have definitely come a long way.

I am going to bed my brakes in again tomorrow, I was not able to bleed the system fully because one of my bleeders was seized in place (had to cut the nipple off and pound a smaller socket on to get it out!), was having some brake bias issues after my ZJ disc conversion that was causing the rears to lock-up before the front and I couldn't test it 100%.

I can defiantly lock up all 4 if I want to though (with 33's)

EDIT:
And don't go for drilled rotors. Standard "blank" good quality rotors (Centric, Brembo, etc) are the best for this application. I wouldn't even go slotted to be honest.

thatXJguy

Really? I'm sure you've seen what my setup looked like by now. Ceramic was strong enough to lock up all fours with all that heavy equipment I had to come to a complete stop on the interstate to avoid an accident. If that's not stopping power I don't know what is LOL.

Please describe your stopping power in more detail and what differences you notice.

With the JK I drive now, having four disk brakes and a better power braking transmission/engine setup stops me on a dime, much faster than the XJ did. I kind of hardly remember what it was like to drive one.

Rogue4x4

They grab better, and take less distance to stop. With the ceramics, I'd say at around 40 MPH, pulling up to a stop sign under normal braking conditions, it would take around 7-8 car lengths to stop. Now it's more like 5-6. Braking in an emergency situation is night and day difference, the semi-mets grab immediately, and slow you down quick like hell, not so with the ceramics I ran, acted like they had brake fade on initial pedal during an emergency type stop...scary. May have been the pads I was running, they weren't anything special, just standard replacements from the parts store. When I did my brakes again, I got new rotors, had them scratch tested and then turned .002, and the more expensive semi-mets...and haven't looked back. I would rather have the stopping power over the increased maintenance, especially with all the armor and such I've added to my rig.

EDIT: Let me also add that I did the disc conversion out back...this has also helped immensely. Stops on a dime now.

thatXJguy

Keep in mind that if you have 4 skidding tires, whether you have metallic or ceramic pads, you've reached max stopping capacity. If all wheels aren't moving, rather skidding (like my instance at highway speeds), then you can't possibly stop shorter unless you get off the brakes and use engine stopping power. Inertia takes over at that point.

In this instance, the only things I can think of that would help are having the stiffest shock possible and the grippiest tire possible.

moparado

Followup.

Good argument on both sides, metalcs vs. ceramics.
I couldn't decide whether to go with full metalics or ceramics.

So i got pads with BOTH! Raybestos Element 3 hybrids.

They noticeably stop better than what i had on there and i think i can even lock the fronts but haven't tried yet keeping in mind i still have stock Mopar shoes/drums in the rear.
Might upgrade those too.

XRF ball joints, Timken hubs, NAPA calipers and AZ hoses were also installed in the process. Good to go for another 327K miles...i hope! lol

thatXJguy

Wow that's cool, a little hybrid. Good luck with the new brakes bud, they should last a long time!

GUARDIAN

I have 4 wdb (WJ) put the power stop semi metallic on all the way around with slotted and cross drilled rotors, (I know, some noise while braking) but it stops. That was over a year ago, no complaints.

mschi772

Technically, if you're skidding, you're NOT stopping as fast as you could be. Maximum deceleration occurs just before a skid. It's hard to feather brake pressure to maintain that which is why ABS's approximation of it is general superior to human braking.

In the context of this thread, though. If a given brake configuration can lock the wheels up, further braking power upgrades will achieve nothing.

I use Black Magic pads.