CheapCharlie

Hello everyone, I am Charlie. I have been lurking in the forums for the last 3 weeks. Looking at every post pertaining to " no start" issues. I have not fixed/found my problem yet.

I got this Jeep for $200, it had the original engine (in place) and a salvage yard transmission in the hatchback. Previous owner had removed the original for the core charge. Also it had sat on blocks in his driveway for 3 years. I reassembled everything and drove it for 6 months. Well the engine began to stall. I checked the compression it had serious compression issues. I then installed a new rebuilt engine, it ran for about 15 minutes, and was very rough and stalled frequently. I got a OBDII scanner code for the IAC. I replaced the IAC and the Jeep has not started since then,(three weeks ago). The old IAC was broken so I can't really put it back in.

Here is a list of new parts on the Jeep. New rebuilt engine, new battery, dist.cap, rotor, plug wires, plugs, ignition coil, crank PS, IAC, alternator, radiator cooling fan, TPS, oil pressure sender, I also put a trailer tail light plug on the back, it required no splicing of wires as it was a direct plug in design.

At this time I am getting no codes, and everything seems to be working ( individually from each other). I have strong spark, it will jump a 1/2" spark to ground. And with a flash tester between the ignition coil to the cap, it continues to fire the whole time I can crank it. " It will only crank for 6 to 8 sec. Yes I know, new battery fully charged with a 50amp booster hooked to it. I have tested the battery with a load tester, after it wouldn't crank the engine any longer, and it shows the battery is still in the good range.

The fuel pressure is 49psi and holds for a good long time (more than 10 min.). All injectors fire 1 at a time, I'm not sure if it is at the right time.

My OBDII scanner tells me the timing is 0.0. I have tried it 180 the other way, it made no difference.

Here are a few observations. If I disable the fuel pump and spray ether in the throttle body " a 3 sec. blast". and then try to start, it will pop half heartedly 3 or 4 times. Also if I remove the fuel rail and leave the injectors in the rail " like a 6 barrel water pistol " and prop the injectors 1/2" from the holes in the intake manifold, while pointing the streams into the manifold holes. It will then pop half heartedly 4 or 5 times it then sounds like it stops for a revolution, and then the next time around it tries 4 or 5 pops again.

Now keep in mind this new engine ran for 15 or 20 minutes. It did not run good, poor idle and stalling. That is when I got the IAC code. The only other codes I have gotten P1694 no CCD Bus, I think someone unplugged the ECU while the key was on. And I unplugged the TCM, to see if it would start without it. It gave me a P1698 no TCM. I plugged those items in and cleared codes and none have returned.

That seems to be a very through explanation, although I'm sure I have omitted some details. Please ask me any questions. I'll do my best to get the info needed.

Thank you in advance, Charlie

DFlintstone

One reason to not run with fuel/spark/compression is being flooded. When you had the injectors squirting in the holes the MAP got no vacuum which would make it very rich. I think you have a little elbow under your MAP on the TB you can check as well as it's wires.

I suppose I might try; disconnect the injectors and try start fluid again. OR try it floorboarded. On my 90 Renix with the petal on the floor, it cuts off injector pulse to clear a flooded condition.

Bad, separated fuel/ethanol happens.......

I don't know what to say about the starter except is is defiantly possible to overheat one cranking too long.

Jharris09

I had similar issues when I rebuilt my own 99 4.0. I fought with it for days and it would not run unless I held the accelerator to the floor and it sounded horrible! I can't tell you which item fixed it because several things at the same time. 1st: I pulled the timing cover and reset the timing sprockets. 2nd: Re-indexed the distributor. Top dead center, compression stroke. 3rd and really what I think my problem was: I had installed a new aftermarket flexplate. I took it off and reinstalled the OEM flexplate. Once it was all done, it fired right up and has run great ever since. There are so many possibilities though, but I feel your pain! Good luck!

CheapCharlie

Today someone removed the plug wires. When they put them back they placed the #1 wire on the #4 tower, but in the proper order. And it started, sortof. Dose anyone have insight on how to locate the distributor. Right now at TDC the rotor is pointing at the tower that is in the 5 o'clock position when facing the engine standing at the right side of the car. I believe this to be correct.

So why will it start 60 degrees off, and why did it run when I first put it together?

Well at least it ran long enough to flash a code, for a cam PS.


Thank you for the input, Charlie

Jharris09

This is what helped me:

CheapCharlie

Thanks JHarris. Good job on that video, but alas I have done that so many times I can do it in my sleep, LOL.

Let me tell you my progress. With the distributor placed in the motor exactly as in your video. The plug wires are placed 1 position counter clockwise. And this is the only way it will start. Keep in mind it runs terribly. Here is an interesting fact.

With my scan tool connected and set on live data. It shows the timing varying from 0.0 deg. to 40.5 degrees. And it will span the full range in less than 1 second.

If you care to comment on that I'd be happy to hear it.

Charlie

docmedpros

As far as timing. My 96 4.0 runs from 13-17 degrees at idle. Did you check timing when it was running rough?

Jharris09

Have you pulled the timing cover to check the timing marks on the crank and cam sprockets? The other part that controls timing is the crank position sensor and the flexplate.

CCKen

OP,


Read this thread:


https://www.cherokeeforum.com/f2/not...roblem-208032/

CCKen

OP,


Is this how your wires are connected to the distributor cap?

CheapCharlie

Hello CCKen. When I posted my issues I was hoping you would reply, Thank you.


In the photos on your link I noticed that the rotor dose not point at the #1 tower, but actually is 1 tooth past it. That explained why it would run with the plug wires moved counter clock wise. BTW Thanks for the photo, as the books and drawings do not depict it that way.


Although I'm not quite done with this thing yet. It starts hard, It seems like I have to depress the gas pedal to the floor to start it. And it has what seems to be a horrible miss ( it miss frequently) the timing now fluctuates between 5deg. and 20deg. at idle. No miss fires are detected.


I would appreciate any thoughts you might have. Charlie

CheapCharlie

Yes I did, doc. I use my scanner to do that. Now it seems to be running in time, but it misses terribly. I'm sure you read my first post, and know what new parts the Jeep has. Today the cam sensor was replaced.


So now I am trying to figure out why it is running so roughly. Thanks for taking an interest.
Charlie

CCKen

If your distributor is installed properly and the plug wires are installed properly and you still have hard starting, miss, and wandering timing, I would suspect a bad Camshaft Position Sensor, or its wiring, or connector.


Not only does the cam sensor tell the PCM exactly what cylinder is in line to be fired (spark), the PCM also uses this data to pulse the fuel injector at the correct time.


Pressing the gas pedal to the floor may indicate that there is unburned fuel hanging around the cylinder from fuel injector mistiming and spark mistiming. Pressing the pedal to the floor leans out that unburned fuel and off you go.

CheapCharlie

I got so sick of this thing, that I took a few days away from it. So I will recap and add some new info.

The questions about timing have been put to rest. The distributor is properly placed in the engine. Also I have taken my PCM/ECU to a different 99 jeep and it ran that engine just fine.

And now for something new, it has 12 to 15hg true manifold pressure at idle. Oh yeah this too, I was checking engine compression. I placed my tester into #3 and didn't unplug anything else and started the engine. here is the curious thing, the first compression stroke it made 145psi, the second about 100psi. Then the engine started, the next cycle was 75psi, and the next was 50psi and it remained at 50psi.

One more thing, this engine was purchased from GearHead.com. If anyone want to comment about that I would like to hear it.

DFlintstone

Yer pullen our leg, right? You just do it cranking. Running you likely killed the gauge. Google wet/dry compression test? Great way to get a snapshot of your engine's health.