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Stock XJ Cherokee Tech. All XJ Non-modified/stock questions go hereXJ (84-01)
All OEM related XJ specific tech. Examples, no start, general maintenance or anything that's stock.
ive known a few people using clearwater and it also comes highly recommended on this site...what issues did you discover about them?
The poor reviews aren't any secret and we know that we haven't seen any negative Clearwater 4.0L head complaints, but the numerous poor reviews regarding customer service just didn't sit well with me. They were also the more expensive option for a rebuilt head. After speaking and meeting with Dale, meeting the guys who do the work as well as knowing it's a TUPY rebuild, couldn't be happier.
My TUPY 0331 rebuild from Windy City Engineering is scheduled to be installed early next week, I'll keep you guys posted..
I obtained a rebuilt head from WIndy City last Fall. I was able to drive to their Chicago location and pick it up so that saved on shipping and no core return is required. No problems so far but not a large number of miles are on it since. Keep in mind it will be a used head with used valves and springs. Clearwater heads are new castings which I believe come from China. Overall I am happy with the decision to go with a TUPY rebuilt head from WIndy City and the price was more reasonable. They do seem to know what they are doing and were easy to work with. I did find some residue in the intake or exhaust port area that may have been left over from valve grinding so make sure things are very clean before installation. I considered Clearwater until I checked their BBB complaints. Overall I think Windy City is a very good option.
My TUPY 0331 rebuild from Windy City Engineering is scheduled to be installed early next week, I'll keep you guys posted..
Raz
I would like to suggest that you make sure attention is paid to keeping things clean during head removal, preparation and reinstallation. You don’t want debris getting onto the engine. Getting all of the old head gasket material off the engine block is difficult and some will resort to a wire wheel, abrasive disc, 3M Roloc disc or sandpaper to make it easier. My recommendation is don’t allow it. Anything that leaves scratches can compromise head gasket sealing. More importantly it is too easy to leave abrasive material behind and for it to go down oil passages or get between the cylinder wall and piston rings. Abrasives used in wheels and the like are extremely sharp and hard. Any material that gets into close clearance areas such as bearings and cylinder walls can quickly do serious damage.
You will hear a lot about heads being replaced and then engines suffering serious damage or failure shortly thereafter. Yes, antifreeze running onto cam bearings makes for a lousy lubricant and can result in catastrophic wear. However, how many engines suffered minimal issues due to antifreeze in the oil were then unnecessarily contaminated during head work that contributed to failure of the engine? If it is mine that fails due to avoidable contamination it is one too many.
For those doing their own work here are some suggestions to help minimize contamination during head replacement. If someone is doing the work for you ask questions. Some will say they didn’t take precautions and the engines went many more miles. Your choice on the risk you want to take.
- Clean engine thoroughly prior to doing any removal. Pay special attention getting gunk off the area around the valve cover and head to block parting lines.
- Avoid dragging straps under head to lift it off the block. This can pull lots of debris onto the top end of engine. Instead use a chain and bolts into any of the larger bolt holes in the head, such as for manifolds and coil pack.
- I found it easier to remove the head with the intake manifold attached.
- Try to avoid dragging head across the block during removal – lift it as straight up as possible
- Placing a bit of grease around the top of each piston can help trap debris from getting between piston and cylinder wall. Place rags in each cylinder.
- Tape off oil passages
- Use a single edge razor blade and carb cleaner to remove all old head gasket material. Yes it is a pain and it takes a long time to do but it is better than doing the job a second time.
- Clean rockers, pushrods and other parts in mineral spirits, paint thinner or similar. Do not blast with anything abrasive such as a glass bead blaster. The abrasive material can remain behind inside pushrods or become embedded in the metal and then damage wear surfaces within minutes of initial startup.
- Use a vacuum and clean rags to clean off top of pistons and block prior to reinstall. Carefully remove any grease and trapped contaminates.
- Make sure bolt holes are clean and dry - no oil in them
- Use a piece of threaded rod into one or two head bolt locations to guide new head onto block without damaging head gasket
- Use a torque wrench on all head and manifold bolts following specified torque sequence.
On saturday i was driving my 00 XJ LTD for about 10 min and was at about 40mph when it sounded and felt like it started missing on one or more cylinders. I was able to safely get off the road where it dies and it cranks but doesn't catch. I looked under the hood and the coolant reservoir was almost empty. I didn't check the oil.
I had it towed to the shop and the guys looked at it on monday. They said that they were able to start and drive it but the best they say so far is "something is broken". It was Xmas eve though so I think they didn't spend much time on it.
I bought it new . In the last two years it has had new radiator, tires, brakes,alternator,battery,alignment, along with regular maintenance. About 5 years ago it suffered from a couple of high temp episodes with the injector vapor lock thing. No issues reported at the last oil change about 3000 miles ago.
I really hope that I have not joined this club. I guess I will find out tomorrow. Might be time to cut my losses.
Last edited by Katherinego; 12-26-2018 at 04:28 PM.
Lack of coolant in the reservoir doesn't sound good unless you have a minor leak somewhere else. Did it overheat? Were your temp and oil pressure gauges showing abnormal readings? Have you ever had the coil pack replaced? Did the check engine light illuminate?
Lack of coolant in the reservoir doesn't sound good unless you have a minor leak somewhere else. Did it overheat? Were your temp and oil pressure gauges showing abnormal readings? Have you ever had the coil pack replaced? Did the check engine light illuminate?
Raz
Hi Raz!
Coil pack replaced? No. I don't think that it overheated at the time that it failed, but I was pretty flustered. We had to get off of the highway and on to a side street where we could be out of traffic. I think that the temp and pressure guages were normal and no CE light that I recall. BTW both the temp and pressure sensors were replaced in the last 6 months.
Waiting patiently to hear what the shop has to say this afternoon.
I would like to suggest that you make sure attention is paid to keeping things clean during head removal, preparation and reinstallation. You don’t want debris getting onto the engine.
Coil pack is known to go bad, results in cylinder misfire. Cheap fix if you're lucky but I'd think it would throw an check engine light if so. I'd have the shop see how much coolant it needs, then do a pressure test (very simply to do) and check the oil for visual signs of coolant given an empty reservoir.
Yeah odd that it didn't throw a code when it was misfiring maybe check your CEL bulb while you're at it. No way to test the coil packs that I know of unfortunately just need to buy new OEM
I hope the shop has now given you more detailed info. They should have informed you if there are any failure codes stored, what the coolant level was in the radiator, oil level/issues, and other basic troubleshooting results they performed. If they can’t answer those questions I would look for another place unless their skilled mechanics are away for the holiday. From what little we know so far your problem could be attributed to many potential causes. Some things to think about:
* A no start problem along with no check engine light/error codes can be caused by a bad crank position sensor (CPS). Typical symptoms will be it will start and run fine and then quit without warning and not restart. Later it may restart and run fine for a short time until it dies again. As a bad sensor can show up with temperature and vibration it is hard to verify with certainty unless it fails completely. A new sensor is around $130 list from Chrysler plus an hour or less of labor. If this sensor is considered for replacement a Chrysler part (56027866AE) is the best bet.
* A fuel pressure check would be helpful to help eliminate a fuel pump problem.
* As mentioned in a prior post a bad coil pack can cause drivability problems but I would think a check engine light and stored fault code would be present.
*As you have likely read, this vintage head is intolerant of being overheated. Two good and relatively inexpensive ways to help eliminate a head related problem are:
1) Have an oil sample pulled and sent for analysis. This will accurately identify if there is any antifreeze in the oil (should be none) and if excessive wear metals are present and in what amount. One good lab is Blackstone Labs: www.blackstone-labs.com If wear metals are excessively high the engine has suffered some significant mechanical problem and you might not want to go further.
2) Have a combustion gas test done on the cooling system. This is done with a simple device that is set onto on the radiator cap opening (not coolant reservoir) and contains a test fluid that changes color in the presence of carbon monoxide, indicating a leak of combustion gas into the cooling system and a potential cracked head.
More info on symptoms and what has been done to identify the problem would be useful.
Last edited by third coast; 12-26-2018 at 06:27 PM.
I had my crank shaft position sensor go out. For me, it resulted in no ignition turn over at all. It was dead, like it had a dead battery.
Another quick test to see if you have the infamous 0331 head crack is to open the oil filler cap with the engine running. Take a peak inside with a flashlight and you'll be able to see a little river of coolant flowing into your motor.
Sad to say that I think it is worse. The tech pulled the valve cover and found a broken valve spring and mangled push rod. Some of the little bits, like a clip have not yet been found. There was no coolant in the oil.
Is there a comprehensive thread about broken valve springs?
It's a clean 00 with no other problems except the AC does not work. I don't have a place to keep it or to work on it. Nevermind that I don't have the skills. Even the best case repair nears blue book value. Do you guys have an idea of what I can sell it for in the Seattle area?
10-24-2018, 07:17 PM
