Project: Tech Snob
CF Veteran
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 5,383
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Year: 1988 limited
Model: Cherokee
Engine: 4.0 litre
OOohhh, finally... hope you will post some dimensions of the fabbed parts
Couple of questions:
What kind of welder are u using?
Did you leave some spots unwelded on the bottom of the plates to let eventual water drain out?
Did you paint the faces that were going towards the frame?
Or are you going to cover everything up with some bondo or rinolining stuff?
Do you have an estimation of the total added weight?
I could calculate the new real torque and power with this infos along with the stroker specs.
I know this is going to be an awesome build thread.
Congrats for your acheivement my friend.

Couple of questions:
What kind of welder are u using?
Did you leave some spots unwelded on the bottom of the plates to let eventual water drain out?
Did you paint the faces that were going towards the frame?
Or are you going to cover everything up with some bondo or rinolining stuff?
Do you have an estimation of the total added weight?
I could calculate the new real torque and power with this infos along with the stroker specs.
I know this is going to be an awesome build thread.
Congrats for your acheivement my friend.
Thread Starter
Senior Member
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 750
Likes: 4
From: Blakeslee, PA
Year: 97
Model: Cherokee
Engine: 4.7
Thread Starter
Senior Member
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 750
Likes: 4
From: Blakeslee, PA
Year: 97
Model: Cherokee
Engine: 4.7
Oh great ........

Originally Posted by fantic238
What kind of welder are u using?
Where you see MIG welds .... Hobart 175. .023/0.30/0.035 wires -- all with shielding gas. Where you see TIG welds ... Lincoln Precision 355 -- with argon shielding gas.
Originally Posted by fantic238
Did you leave some spots unwelded on the bottom of the plates to let eventual water drain out?
They were drilled after I welded the frame plates on. Didn't want to take a chance trying to match up holes. I did mark them when they were installed, so I could utilze the existing holes in the rails.
Originally Posted by fantic238
Did you paint the faces that were going towards the frame?
Yes ... and I mentioned it already. Zinc Primer/Cold Galvinizing compound. Brand I used was ZRC Worldwide.
Originally Posted by fantic238
Or are you going to cover everything up with some bondo or rinolining stuff?
Patience.
Originally Posted by fantic238
Do you have an estimation of the total added weight?
Not even a clue. The best I can do is weigh the vehicle after it's all done. A lot of weight was definitely added.

Originally Posted by fantic238
I could calculate the new real torque and power with this infos along with the stroker specs.
I really wasn't keen on getting a stroker, actually. I would have been just as satisfied with a regular 4.0 motor. I know how to make them respond. The motor in my 4.0 had so much torque I didn't know what to do with it. Now I cannot imagine the additional torque from the stroker combo. But the motor deal was too good to pass up (no cash exchanged hands .... )
Originally Posted by fantic238
I know this is going to be an awesome build thread.
Congrats for your acheivement my friend.
Congrats for your acheivement my friend.

Glad you like it. Hope it's worth the wait ---I'll be stretching this out a bit.
Last edited by EndlessMtnFab; Aug 28, 2009 at 06:09 AM.
Thread Starter
Senior Member
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 750
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From: Blakeslee, PA
Year: 97
Model: Cherokee
Engine: 4.7
Now that all immediate chassis/frame work has been completed .... time to pretend I'm a body man again.
Some POR 15, followed by etching primer & epoxy primer .... and we have ....
The trans tunnel has been done as well. But I don't have any pictures of that.
Once everything cured ... I got my shutz gun and sprayed some Speedliner (with Kevlar) in the bay. Should last longer than the rest of the vehicle.
The 2 black spots by the shock mounts were my decision to remove some of the primer in anticipation of shock mods later on. I will "touch up" the area when I am done.
Once the liner cured .... Jay (from Philly area) came up to help me get the motor in.
Some POR 15, followed by etching primer & epoxy primer .... and we have ....
The trans tunnel has been done as well. But I don't have any pictures of that.
Once everything cured ... I got my shutz gun and sprayed some Speedliner (with Kevlar) in the bay. Should last longer than the rest of the vehicle.
The 2 black spots by the shock mounts were my decision to remove some of the primer in anticipation of shock mods later on. I will "touch up" the area when I am done.
Once the liner cured .... Jay (from Philly area) came up to help me get the motor in.
Thread Starter
Senior Member
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 750
Likes: 4
From: Blakeslee, PA
Year: 97
Model: Cherokee
Engine: 4.7
When the motor was installed, I simply bolted the trans to the block. There is no clutch, flywheel, etc installed at this point. It's mainly in place so I can mock my drivetrain measurements & dimensions.
At any rate, some time in the wayyyy distant past I purchased one of these.
Ain't she purdy?
Disassembling for rebuild and some parts changing.
Washing down with POR prep and painting. Gotta make sure it shines to impress everyone.
Definitely enough bearings & needles.
What I swapped out.
New guts, new shaft.

Lemme tell you ..... this sucker is heavy. I think it weighed 72 lbs on the scale.
At any rate, some time in the wayyyy distant past I purchased one of these.
Ain't she purdy?
Disassembling for rebuild and some parts changing.
Washing down with POR prep and painting. Gotta make sure it shines to impress everyone.

Definitely enough bearings & needles.
What I swapped out.
New guts, new shaft.

Lemme tell you ..... this sucker is heavy. I think it weighed 72 lbs on the scale.
Thread Starter
Senior Member
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 750
Likes: 4
From: Blakeslee, PA
Year: 97
Model: Cherokee
Engine: 4.7
Also ... In that same way distant past, I purchased one of these. Thirty bucks !!!
No wonder it was only 30 bucks !!!
News Bulletin. Oil is an accepted lubricant. Mud is not. Never seen gears this melted before.
Located some good used gears (take note how clean and shiny it is inside) and installed a JB Conversions HD rear output. A front output will be installed someday as cash funds allow. There are more important things I need to get for the Jeep in the mean time.
No wonder it was only 30 bucks !!!
News Bulletin. Oil is an accepted lubricant. Mud is not. Never seen gears this melted before.
Located some good used gears (take note how clean and shiny it is inside) and installed a JB Conversions HD rear output. A front output will be installed someday as cash funds allow. There are more important things I need to get for the Jeep in the mean time.
CF Veteran
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 5,383
Likes: 5
Year: 1988 limited
Model: Cherokee
Engine: 4.0 litre
Where you see MIG welds .... Hobart 175. .023/0.30/0.035 wires -- all with shielding gas. Where you see TIG welds ... Lincoln Precision 355 -- with argon shielding gas.
They were drilled after I welded the frame plates on. Didn't want to take a chance trying to match up holes. I did mark them when they were installed, so I could utilze the existing holes in the rails.
Yes ... and I mentioned it already. Zinc Primer/Cold Galvinizing compound. Brand I used was ZRC Worldwide.
Not even a clue. The best I can do is weigh the vehicle after it's all done. A lot of weight was definitely added.


Glad you like it. Hope it's worth the wait ---I'll be stretching this out a bit.
CF Veteran
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 5,383
Likes: 5
Year: 1988 limited
Model: Cherokee
Engine: 4.0 litre
Wooh, the dana300 looks like it was buried in the middle ages, and recently found, lol.
Will you use double shifters? That will be three levers with the first reducer.
Will you use double shifters? That will be three levers with the first reducer.
Thread Starter
Senior Member
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 750
Likes: 4
From: Blakeslee, PA
Year: 97
Model: Cherokee
Engine: 4.7
Settings can only get you so far.
A lot has to do with the machine. Hobart is the "economy line" for Miller Welding. Similar construction ... cheaper materials.
The "biggie" is the lack of heat settings. 4 positions is all you get. That stems mostly from using aluminum windings inside the machine (instead of copper). The aluminum doesn't have the ability to disperse the heat like the copper does. Nor does it conduct metal as well. Both of these effect how low you can turn the amperage down (and still have a solid arc). Obviously, If you have a 110 (lower US voltage) machine .... you won't run into this issue. I'm currently trying to work to work out a deal with a private buyer for their Miller 252DX machine. For what it's worth --- I'm not the only person I know with this issue. That's why all the local collision shops have 2 machines. A 110 unit for all the sheetmetal work and a 220 unit for anything over 11 gauge.
This build is taking long enough ... I don't have the time to TIG an entire frame rail. Especially where there are inconsistent gaps. And the weld-thru primer does not "play nice" with TIG. Even the manufacturer suggested only ARC or MIG welding with their product. ESAB makes a wire that I will be trying soon. It's a "soft" wire designed for body work. Not rated for structural load .... but should be suitable for fender & body work.
I appreciate your input .... but I have a pretty good handle on how to weld. Sometimes you just can't have picture perfect welds, even though they can be as solid as heck. There is a reason for undercoating, you understand.
I'm still building it. All my "friends" disappeared when I needed them the most. See if I ever lift a finger to help them again.
A lot has to do with the machine. Hobart is the "economy line" for Miller Welding. Similar construction ... cheaper materials.
The "biggie" is the lack of heat settings. 4 positions is all you get. That stems mostly from using aluminum windings inside the machine (instead of copper). The aluminum doesn't have the ability to disperse the heat like the copper does. Nor does it conduct metal as well. Both of these effect how low you can turn the amperage down (and still have a solid arc). Obviously, If you have a 110 (lower US voltage) machine .... you won't run into this issue. I'm currently trying to work to work out a deal with a private buyer for their Miller 252DX machine. For what it's worth --- I'm not the only person I know with this issue. That's why all the local collision shops have 2 machines. A 110 unit for all the sheetmetal work and a 220 unit for anything over 11 gauge.
This build is taking long enough ... I don't have the time to TIG an entire frame rail. Especially where there are inconsistent gaps. And the weld-thru primer does not "play nice" with TIG. Even the manufacturer suggested only ARC or MIG welding with their product. ESAB makes a wire that I will be trying soon. It's a "soft" wire designed for body work. Not rated for structural load .... but should be suitable for fender & body work.
I appreciate your input .... but I have a pretty good handle on how to weld. Sometimes you just can't have picture perfect welds, even though they can be as solid as heck. There is a reason for undercoating, you understand.

I'm still building it. All my "friends" disappeared when I needed them the most. See if I ever lift a finger to help them again.
Last edited by EndlessMtnFab; Aug 28, 2009 at 07:41 AM.
Thread Starter
Senior Member
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 750
Likes: 4
From: Blakeslee, PA
Year: 97
Model: Cherokee
Engine: 4.7
Probably not far from the truth. But it cleaned up nicely with some glass bead & alum oxide media.
Yes ... I will use a twin stick. You did an awful lot of schooling to do basic level math.
CF Veteran
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 5,383
Likes: 5
Year: 1988 limited
Model: Cherokee
Engine: 4.0 litre
The "biggie" is the lack of heat settings. 4 positions is all you get. That stems mostly from using aluminum windings inside the machine (instead of copper). The aluminum doesn't have the ability to disperse the heat like the copper does. Nor does it conduct metal as well. Both of these effect how low you can turn the amperage down (and still have a solid arc). Obviously, If you have a 110 (lower US voltage) machine .... you won't run into this issue. I'm currently trying to work to work out a deal with a private buyer for their Miller 252DX machine. For what it's worth --- I'm not the only person I know with this issue. That's why all the local collision shops have 2 machines. A 110 unit for all the sheetmetal work and a 220 unit for anything over 11 gauge.
We've got 380v triple phase in the shop, the MIG is of a local builder, there are dozens aroud here. Current settings go from 1 to 10. It's a very old unit, but works great.
I appreciate your input .... but I have a pretty good handle on how to weld. Sometimes you just can't have picture perfect welds, even though they can be as solid as heck. There is a reason for undercoating, you understand.
I'm still building it. All my "friends" disappeared when I needed them the most. See if I ever lift a finger to help them again.
That suks, they weren't real friends then. If i was there, i would have helped you with pleasure.
Yes ... I will use a twin stick. You did an awful lot of schooling to do basic level math.
Don't go cheap with those sticks. They bend like butter, especially those with the thin bar welded to the plate, crap.
These:
Thread Starter
Senior Member
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 750
Likes: 4
From: Blakeslee, PA
Year: 97
Model: Cherokee
Engine: 4.7
110 and 220 are the "normal" supplied household currents in the States. 110 would be your lights, radio, computer, vibrator, fridge, etc. 220 is common used for electric baseboard heat, electric dryer, and so forth. Most garages or shops in the area are limited to 220 single phase unless they choose to pay for 3 phase. Then it typically jumps to 440 volts.
As such .... I chose the 220 volt, 175 amp (output) welder for the abiilty to do thicker materials. I remain on single phase. When I purchase a larger mill, I will buy one of those converter/generators to power the mill.
I will be making my own shifters. Something a bit nicer than that.
Joe
Thread Starter
Senior Member
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 750
Likes: 4
From: Blakeslee, PA
Year: 97
Model: Cherokee
Engine: 4.7
CF Veteran
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 5,383
Likes: 5
Year: 1988 limited
Model: Cherokee
Engine: 4.0 litre
You miss the pictures and comments about the weld thru/galvinizing compound
Tells me where your mind is.
I don't know either where my mind is sometimes...
But let's not get off topic, i don't want to contaminate your build thread with my mental subtleties.
I wish you to get that panzer to wheel soon, at least for MOAB 2010


