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You have a very valid point and I completely understand it. But it would be like comparing it to the argument that seat belts can kill you. How often has this actually happened compared to how many times seat belts have saved someone? Nothing is completely fool proof and there are always variables that nothing could survive. I know one thing... These might as well be a convertible with no cage at all with just the factory skeleton.
I don't know. I've seen and had quite a few members in the club i go with have roll overs in xjs. One went down a pretty long slope. I was too far back in the group to see it, but when I got there and looked down, It looked pretty damn scary. The roof held up. The major damage was on the doors, but he hit some trees at the bottom. I don't think they are all that weak stock. About the same as all other vehicles in the same era. but then again I wouldn't want to test the theory like you have man haha
I don't know. I've seen and had quite a few members in the club i go with have roll overs in xjs. One went down a pretty long slope. I was too far back in the group to see it, but when I got there and looked down, It looked pretty damn scary. The roof held up. The major damage was on the doors, but he hit some trees at the bottom. I don't think they are all that weak stock. About the same as all other vehicles in the same era. but then again I wouldn't want to test the theory like you have man haha
Here's the difference... I have had mine upside down and the damage it sustained should not at all been what it was considering the circumstances. I wrecked my Bronco II at 60 MPH and it didn't do as much damage. There is a world of difference in the ductile strength of the metal on these compared to that Ford. I could tell as soon as I started banging the Jeep back into shape compared to when I banged the Bronco back into shape. If you have ever done any body work it becomes obvious the first tap with the hammer how ductile the metal is.
You have a very valid point and I completely understand it. But it would be like comparing it to the argument that seat belts can kill you. How often has this actually happened compared to how many times seat belts have saved someone? Nothing is completely fool proof and there are always variables that nothing could survive. I know one thing... These might as well be a convertible with no cage at all with just the factory skeleton.
At 2:05 he shows a shot of the Jeep and you can see there's no roll cage. Just a roof basket. If the shell was as weak as you say, I think the damage would've been much more severe.
Not saying the factory shell is great or anything, but give it a little credit.
Originally Posted by roninofako
Bugout, do it, and post it up. It's your ride, and your decision. Sounds like you know the pros and cons now, plus it's different.
At 2:05 he shows a shot of the Jeep and you can see there's no roll cage. Just a roof basket. If the shell was as weak as you say, I think the damage would've been much more severe.
Not saying the factory shell is great or anything, but give it a little credit.
I really think the rack saved his from being much worse that it was. My roll over was almost exactly the same but I went over much slower and it stayed on the top. I'll have to get some pictures to explain what I am personally experiencing with mine and why I make this claim. Did you happen to read what I explained about the difference with the Bronco metal?
I like the idea of embedding the square tube inside the pillars. If done correctly and gusseted appropriately it can be incredibly strong. I was thinking of doing something similar but with no tubing at all. All fabricated steel with dimple dies. Of the style in the picture, although that is just a random pic I found, not even sure what it is.
The one thing I will caution with the square tubing. Do not, EVER, butt weld two pieces together without an inner sleeve or ample exterior gusseting. Butt welds without reinforcement WILL fail.
Here is another example of what I am talking about. Here they used the dimpled steel to connect the cage to the A-pillar. But you could use dimpled steel to create "structures" attached to the body, the pillars, and the roof. Maybe even exo...
The one thing I will caution with the square tubing. Do not, EVER, butt weld two pieces together without an inner sleeve or ample exterior gusseting. Butt welds without reinforcement WILL fail.
Oh absolutely... It goes without saying that the corners will have to be strengthened and tied together. I may have mentioned this earlier at some point. I like your idea too if I had availability to the equipment. Anything to give the skeleton more overall strength. I see you have visualized what I am getting at with the embedding concept. A hybrid per say and they will help add strength to each other.
I don't really like the look of most exoskeletons so one of my ideas is to beef up the A, B, C and D pillars on the inside and then tie those into a beefy roof rack. So the roof rack itself will be an exoskeleton, but it will look mostly like a normal roof rack.
I don't really like the look of most exoskeletons so one of my ideas is to beef up the A, B, C and D pillars on the inside and then tie those into a beefy roof rack. So the roof rack itself will be an exoskeleton, but it will look mostly like a normal roof rack.
Very good idea, and beefing up the pillars is the main thing.
I really think the rack saved his from being much worse that it was. My roll over was almost exactly the same but I went over much slower and it stayed on the top. I'll have to get some pictures to explain what I am personally experiencing with mine and why I make this claim. Did you happen to read what I explained about the difference with the Bronco metal?
Yeah, I remember your post about the bronco metal. And I'm sure the roof rack helped minimize some of the damage, BUT that roof rack isn't attached to a cage either exo or interior, so it's just attached to the roof and/or the rain gutters. So the structure of the body is what held the rack up.
Yeah, I remember your post about the bronco metal. And I'm sure the roof rack helped minimize some of the damage, BUT that roof rack isn't attached to a cage either exo or interior, so it's just attached to the roof and/or the rain gutters. So the structure of the body is what held the rack up.
With the weight on it, the roof was squashed in almost all the way to the rear hatch. The only reason the passenger side did not crush more was because the gutter accidentally folded over the top of the doors on that side... or this would have been flat all the way across to behind the rear seats. It almost stayed on it's side and just very slowly teetered over on to the top. Too much damage for the circumstances here. I hope it never does, but you will understand if it happens to you my friend.
Yeah, I remember your post about the bronco metal. And I'm sure the roof rack helped minimize some of the damage, BUT that roof rack isn't attached to a cage either exo or interior, so it's just attached to the roof and/or the rain gutters. So the structure of the body is what held the rack up.
I have it pulled back out about 60% from where it actually was here.
Yeah, I remember your post about the bronco metal. And I'm sure the roof rack helped minimize some of the damage, BUT that roof rack isn't attached to a cage either exo or interior, so it's just attached to the roof and/or the rain gutters. So the structure of the body is what held the rack up.
And the worst part? I measured out the subframe and it is twisted about 6 inches. This was too gentle of a roll over to have twisted the frame that much.
And the worst part? I measured out the subframe and it is twisted about 6 inches. This was too gentle of a roll over to have twisted the frame that much.
6 inches!??? Wow. I love my ZJ but I will be upgrading the entire structure one piece at a time. And for the people that say it adds weight... so does a passenger. Or two passengers. I can do a LOT of upgrades for the weight of one 200 pound passenger.
6 inches!??? Wow. I love my ZJ but I will be upgrading the entire structure one piece at a time. And for the people that say it adds weight... so does a passenger. Or two passengers. I can do a LOT of upgrades for the weight of one 200 pound passenger.
Lol... That's where I'm at! And it will ride better!
12-24-2017, 11:04 AM
