AW4 Correct Fluid?
 

The owner's manual and the Chrysler service manual both say to use Mopar Dexron IIE/Mercon fluid for the automatic AW4 transmission. But then, on page 21-185 of the Chrysler service manual (in section for AW4 transmission - Oil Pump Volume Check) it says "fill to proper level with Mopar ATF PLUS 3 (Type 7176)." And again on the next page it says to use ATF PLUS 3.

So which is it? Dexron IIE/Mercon or ATF PLUS 3? or are they interchangable, because I'd heard that they weren't.

I have always used dextron 3,I am pretty sure is now atf plus 3,the dextron 11E is I think mopars ols designation for there version of trany fluid,I have never seen it before.

Ok, so the Dextron III is now called ATF PLUS 3 and then it would be safe to use the ATF PLUS 4 that they sell at the Auto parts store?

I'm really new at this, and I'm going to use the "disconnect return line" method for changing the trans fluid this weekend, I just don't want to put the wrong stuff in and destroy my transmission. I also need to change the filter and the way the exhaust pipe is run it blocks access to several bolts on the transmission pan, so that's going to be a lot of fun I'm sure. :wacko:

Oh that reminds me, anyone know what to do about the fill tube which is connected to the pan. I'm assuming that needs to be disconnected before you can remove the pan. I see that you can disconnect the top half from the bottom half, but is it better to disconnect it at the pan itself. It didn't look like it is supposed to removed there.

here is what I can tell you,I use dextron 3 in the trany and transfer case,it is all I have ever used,atf plus 3 per the auto parts here is the same thing but synthetic based,hence the plus. the atf plus 4 I think is for ford. As far as the dip stick goes,you should not have to remove it to drop the pan,I guess you are going to do a flush and not just change the fluid correct,I am little confused about the returm method unless you are flushing it out with a pump and filters.

My plan is to drain the pan, remove the pan, clean off the old gasket, replace the filter, reinstall the pan with new gasket, add 3 quarts of fluid. Then, remove the return line, place it in a bucket marked with 1 quart intervals, start the car and put it in neutral, and add fluid as the fluid is pumped out of the return line at the same rate. When the dark fluid is out and fresh red fluid is going into the bucket, stop the car, reconnect return line, and top off the fluid. So, effectively, you "flush" the transmission by using it's own pump rather than force flushing it.

The thing about the dipstick tube is that it goes into the bottom of the pan, so it looks like if I drop the pan down, the tube will go with it unless I disconnect it somewhere.

Attachment 388550

Sorry that picture is so huge, I shrank it in the reply but it didn't seem to work.

The tube should just come out with pan,you should be able to see if it is attached somwhere,I would look at mine except the starter just went out and it is downtown,where I am headed to change it.

I've used the Dexron III/ Mercon or how ever you spell it in mines. So far no problems. I used the Valvoline.

I wouldn't bother dropping the pan unless you really feel the need to. I did that on two of mine and found nothing in the pan filter. Waste of time. I'm not the only one who has found that out.
When you pull the plug to drain the old fluid look on the bottom of the plug to see if you have metal shavings. Depending on the miles you will usually always find some small mud-looking metal on there. That is normal. If you find a lot you may want to drop the pan. You could drain the pan into a strainer and get a look at all the fluid if you like.
I asuppose if your pan is leaking (can't remember if you said that) then you may as well drop the pan. If you see a leak on your pan just make sure it's tranny fluid before you think the pan has a leak. It could be oil from the rear main seal, valve gasket or pan gasket. Sometimes you find radiator fluid down there too.

One of mine had 246,000 miles on it. I still found only the token mud-like fine shavings on the mag plug. It's a PITA to drop the pan unless you are lifted or have a lift to do it on.

If you do drop the pan place an old sock over the dipstick and tube so you don't scratch your paint up.
If you search you will see the topic of what fluid to use discussed many times. I have read them all and I use Dex 111. Seems to have the best arguments towards using that. I'm sick of that argument so Dex111 it is until my tranny blows or just lasts forever!

Mike

Thanks Mike! I'll go with that approach, sounds like some sound reasoning to me. And I'll just use the Dex III and see how it goes. Transmission is working great right now, no clunks or trouble shifting, shifts quick and is responsive to changes in speed and acceleration. But the fluid is pretty dark, almost brown/gray with slight red tint so I figure change it now before I have a problem.

Dexron fluids and Mopar ATF fluids are supposedly compatible...

BUT...

Your AW-4 was designed to use Dexron II. Which is no longer available, so Dex III is you next best choice.

The problems with AW-4s slipping while using ATF+4 are the trannies with over 100k on them. Once an AW-4 has been on Dexron, it needs to stay on Dexron.

Now someone is going to come in here and say "look Chrysler released this TSB saying ATF+4 is fine for the AW-4"... Well.. yes they did. After the last AW-4's would have been out of the warranty period.. meaning they had no responsibilty to replace the ones damaged by using ATF+4 in them.

mercon only??


mercon V ??


not the old dex/merc like the old GM and some later fords?


or?

kind of confusing

had this problem with a 96 taurus AX4N recently that we replaced

he put regular dextron mercon in it t fill it and well it was shifting extrmeley harsh hard


had to drop the pan and refill with mercon V


without dex in it



fixed it now its smooth as a sewing machine each shift


its crazy how some trans models will run like completely horribly with just the wrong fluid type

i dnt knwow the differences in the make up fluids but OMG it can screw them up royally

somehow

i wish i knew why



thanks

Man, this is getting complicated. Even the service manual doesn't seem sure which fluid is right. And I bought this truck used so I have no idea what fluid the PO put in it. I think I'm going to go with the Dex III/Merc first b/c it mentions that in the "proper fluid" section of the manual and if it feels like it's shifting rough maybe change it to ATF+4 (which it mentions in the "oil pump" section of the manual). Maybe I'll mix the two together and then I can have the best of both worlds :) j/k

http://www.go.jeep-xj.info/HowtoAutoService.htm

Pretty good write up on servicing an AT. Covers everything and talks about the dipstick disconnect.

I'm planning to do this sometime when I get a free weekend, don't think the fluid has been changed in mine for a while.

Dex III/Merc is the correct stuff... Put it in be happy....

Chrysler didn't design, buy or specify the AW-4. Aisin Warner and Toyota(the other AW-4 user) NEVER specified ATF +4. Chrysler owns ATF+4, so they have a vested intrest in selling that to you. While AW-4s were under warranty by the thousands Chrysler's TSB specifically exempted AW-4s from ATF+4 recommendations. It wasnt until 2007 when all but '01 models would have had their warranties expire, so Chrysler wouldn't be on the hook for tranny failures caused by using ATF+4 in the AW-4.

So ask yourself two things... Why after exempting the AW-4 for 18+ years in ATF+4 recommendations why suddenly did Chrysler start recommending it??

Also.. we know what came from the factory(Dex II,III), why would you want to change that???